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Author: Subject: The "Fiction Workshop's" Success?

Fanatic





Posts: 206
Registered: 1/1/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 28/3/2004 at 10:52 AM
Well, lack there off. At least thats what it seems like to me. Thta really sucks. I'm extremely curious as to whether or not anyone has actually sent Britva any works of theirs, or is everyone here an expert god damned writer. That entire section was added as a plexus-like resource for learning and skill, and no one uses it?! Well maybe I'm overreacting, but fork it up people: Have you posted? Have you helped? How much does a bear weigh? And for god's sake, don't ask me why I haven't posted anything; I'm a god damned prince, Ackly kid. Best bastard I ever knew. To hell with you...

 

____________________
The only thing that can alter the good writer is death.
You know that if I were reincarnated, Id want to come back a buzzard. Nothing hates him. He is never bothered or in danger, and he can eat anything.
Faulkner

 

Moderator




Posts: 37
Registered: 1/8/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 29/3/2004 at 01:08 AM
Total submissions received by me so far = 0.

However, it's only been about a week, and I know sometimes it takes a lot longer than that to get a story in good enough shape that you want to show it to someone else. That said, I would encourage everyone who is eagerly awaiting stories to read to get off their asses and write one

And please people, don't be intimidated by the fact that these stories are going to be critiqued. I've been through this process dozens of times, and trust me, it doesn't hurt that bad.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 206
Registered: 1/1/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 29/3/2004 at 04:47 AM
Yeah, it has only been a week. But there is no shortage of posts to the article section, and god knows all 20 won't go up. They could go the other direction but.....aprehension, the emotional gimp leg.

 

____________________
The only thing that can alter the good writer is death.

You know that if I were reincarnated, Id want to come back a buzzard.
Nothing hates him. He is never bothered or in danger, and he can eat
anything.

Faulkner

 

Fanatic




Posts: 499
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 06:57 AM
Art cannot be taught, you fascist.

 

____________________
Light is changing to shadow, and casting a shroud over all we have known.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 206
Registered: 1/1/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 09:45 AM
Ok, I understand that. Never said it could, either. But, people who make shitty art, or perhaps shitty comments, can be helped. Well, at least sometimes. Some people are so far up their own asses, that they just can't be saved. A shame, really.

[Edited on 30/3/2004 by Squire-of-Gothos]

 

____________________
The only thing that can alter the good writer is death.


You know that if I were reincarnated, Id want to come back a buzzard. />
Nothing hates him. He is never bothered or in danger, and he can eat

anything.


Faulkner

 

Fanatic




Posts: 499
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 09:49 AM
Could you define the adjective 'shitty' please.

 

____________________
Light is changing to shadow, and casting a shroud over all we have known.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 247
Registered: 19/1/2004
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 10:28 AM
I have a story to submit and I will do so when I go home for my lunch break. It is saved on my computer at home. I have no problem with being the first victum of this new project and would love some constructive advice on my writing. If my arrands don't take my entire 1 hour lunch I will submit it then.

 

____________________
Suicide Hotline - Please Hold

 

Moderator




Posts: 37
Registered: 1/8/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 10:39 AM
It's not about teaching art; it's about teaching craft and technique. The art is in what you say, but it's no good unless you say it in an effective way that connects with people.

Besides, even the most famous writers still go through a process of review and criticism before their works get published. Trust me, it's very rare that anyone gets it just right on their first draft, no matter who they are.

Now... can someone tell me... did I take this comment too seriously?

 

Moderator




Posts: 37
Registered: 1/8/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 10:53 AM
Ok, ok, I fed the troll. My apologies.

And, I'm looking forward to getting your submission Rayce.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 499
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 11:20 AM
You can bait me all you like, big boy! Now let me think of an exually witty come-back that will try and make you look like a fool...

So you are saying that Tachism is not an acceptable style?

Raise the bar too much did I? Fascist.

 

____________________
Light is changing to shadow, and casting a shroud over all we have known.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 247
Registered: 19/1/2004
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 02:36 PM
I was looking at the article I was going to submit to you which is a bondage porn kinda thing I wrote a few years ago. It needs to reviewed so I'll have to wait and submit it after I spell check it and clean it up. Didn't realize I had never done the final draft.

Also.. is bondage porn ok for the fiction workshop?

 

____________________
Suicide Hotline - Please Hold

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 1810
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 02:44 PM
Abbadon: no offense... writing is a skill... and THAT can be taught...

Feral

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.

Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Fanatic




Posts: 247
Registered: 19/1/2004
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 02:51 PM
Oh.. and are chapters ok? What are your rules on chapters? I have it all done and it has a cliff hanger ending but I would be sending you the entire thing. Do you want all the chapters in one document or seperate? Let me know.

 

____________________
Suicide Hotline - Please Hold

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 656
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 05:00 PM
*contemplates on calling Abbadon a Communist*
 

Moderator




Posts: 37
Registered: 1/8/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 06:18 PM
In response to Rayce: I really only want to post stories tha are complete (i.e. no chapters or unfinished stories). My reasons for this are in the fiction workshop announcement in the articles section. As far as posting bondage porn goes, I'm really not sure until I read it. This may or may not fall under the "genre fiction" guidleine. Basically, if the whole point of the story is to graphically describe a bondage scene for the purpose of titllation (i.e. wanking) then I would probably not post it. If the purpose of the story was to accurately portray people who engage in bondage and/or to explore some of the underlying intellectual, emotional, and physical issues involved in bondage, and the story also happened to feature some really hot, graphic bondage sex, then I would post it in a heartbeat.

However, even though I might not post it, I don't want to discourage anyone from sending me porn they've written whenever they feel like it.

In response to Abbadon: Even though painting and writing are related, I think bringing up Tachism is a little like comparing apples and oranges. Tachism, at least in my understanding was an attempt to produce abstract art unmediated by the conscious mind. In other words, these painters in the 40's and 50's wanted to be free of any formal structure or style. This is a lot easier to do in painting than it is in writing because in writing you are still constrained to a certain extent by the structure and rules of language.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the point I assume you're making is that it's impossible to formulate any rules about art because eventually someone will produce great art that breaks the rules (or attempts to avoid the rules entirely). The thing is, no one here is trying to come up with any "rules" for good writing.

All writers are attempting to connect with an audience, otherwise they would stick to their journals. The point of a fiction workshop is to get feedback from the audience so you can accomplish this more effectively. Now if you think the shmeng membership is not representative of the audience you are trying to engage/move/provoke/enlighten/whatever then feel free not to submit to this workshop. For the most part, though, I think we have a smart, creative group of people here, and I think any workshop discussion could be really valuable both to the writer and to the critics.

Ironically, the term "Tachism" was not coined by the artists, but by the community of writers and critics who discussed the paintings.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 247
Registered: 19/1/2004
Status: Offline

  posted on 30/3/2004 at 07:27 PM
Ok, then sadly I have nothing to submit because the thing I was going to submit is in chapters.

 

____________________
Suicide Hotline - Please Hold

 

Fanatic




Posts: 206
Registered: 1/1/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 31/3/2004 at 03:35 AM
Playing the devils advocate, as this is MY forum, you rapscalion bastard, how about Stream of consciousness writing? I mean, thats a structureless form of writing, right? But you see, the key here is, that most good stream of consciousness writers have honed their skill, to the point where even a rant lacking punctuation, prior planning, or thought can be a good read. So, yeah. And as for art, I.E. tachism, art is something where just the colors and shapes are like the words of a writer. It is much easier to perceive emotion, and enjoy a painting, that lacks structure. That is whats so great about art: jackson Polock can be terribly angry and depressed, throw his paints as such, and voila! Art. I can't chuck a typwriter down a staircase in anger and expect War and Peace. So from a pissed off writer, who WELCOMES critiques, if I'm a fascist, well then: Zieg Heil! Zeig Heil!

~Squire, of the third reich



 

____________________
The only thing that can alter the good writer is death.

/>
You know that if I were reincarnated, Id want to come back a
buzzard.
/>

Nothing hates him. He is never bothered or in danger, and he can eat />

anything.



Faulkner

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 656
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 31/3/2004 at 08:49 AM
Gothos: You're not a fascist, he's just a Communist.
 

Member




Posts: 63
Registered: 27/3/2003
Status: Offline

  posted on 31/3/2004 at 03:22 PM
I don't want to start some big argument about it, but personally, I don't like the rules set for the fiction workshop, and I think they're the reason that the workshop is kinda dead. No genres, no death, no this, no that... I mean, come on. What do you want then, those little stories from baby books? Even Disney has death and usually follows genre.
How do you expect to recieve any "good" writing when you set a criteria that the "good" writing has to follow. Who are you to judge what is good or not. Whats good to you may not be good to me, and I might not waste my time reading it. Whats good to me might not be good to squire, and he wouldn't want to waste his time reading it. And as far as that goes, who are you to dictate what the fiction can't be about and still expect to get something that people would be interested in. Diversity is what makes fiction so good. Some of the best fiction centers around death, horror, and choas. Some of the best fiction follow genres, such as horror, sci-fi, or porn. Some of the best writing comes in installations. If it's good, then you can't wait for the next installation. If it's shit, then no one gives a damn.
Someone had been writing a story in installations on here, FIGMENTS, and it was damn good writing. Several people greatly enjoyed it. Not only was it FANTASY, which broke one of your little rules. It also came it parts. The girl who was writing it submitted it as she wrote more. It wasn't finished, so there goes another one of your rules, BUT it was still good writing that a lot of people enjoyed.
Which brings up another point. Almost all writing is unfinished, because no matter what you do to it, you can always add more. What if a work of fiction is finished, but the ending is shit? Some people would consider it unfinished because you don't get that feeling of fulfillment at the end. It's over on paper, but it's not over with in your mind.
Britva, I don't know you personally, but I assume you write and know a thing or two about writing, since you're such a fucking expert on what's good or not, but I don't think your standards should dictate the rest of our standards.
I'd be happy if the way fiction was submitted went back to the way it was. I'd help the editors read and edit the works they get because personally, I think this new way of doing it sucks.

I had some fiction that I wanted to submit because I finally got it typed up. I sent it to Devin and he liked it. However, it doesn't follow the rules you set up, Britva, so I'm not even going to bother sending it and wasting your time, or my time.

 

____________________
In my eyes, to be human is not to be able to live and die, but it is to feel pain, love, happiness, and all other things that keep our hearts from freezing over into the bloody ice that distinguishes man from the beasts of night.

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 1810
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 31/3/2004 at 04:21 PM
abbadon: shitty, according to dictionary.com
1 Of very poor quality; highly inferior.
2 Contemptible; despicable.
3 Unfortunate; unpleasant.
4 Being in a state of discomfort or unhappiness; miserable.
5 Incompetent; inept.
6 Trivial; insignificant.

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.



Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 
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