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Author: Subject: weakness

Occasional Poster





Posts: 20
Registered: 2/2/2008
Status: Offline

  posted on 3/2/2008 at 01:27 PM
I wrote this a while ago.
Feel pity for the weak for their lives are just as precious as yours, to fell pity is to understand what the weak is going through. Love your enemies, cause their llives are precious too, maybe not to us, but to somebody, the value of another being is important. Without value, live would carelessly be thrown away.
It's no worse being weak then when you are strong, When you are weakm the strong protect you. but when you are strong, who do you turn to? to be weak is to help the strong, for the strong have a need, the strong has to have someone to admire them, who looks up to the weak? When you are inbetween-no one cares.

 

Occasional Poster




Posts: 42
Registered: 3/10/2003
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  posted on 3/2/2008 at 11:42 PM
I'm not sure you can differentiate like that between strong and weak people...perhaps it would be better to talk about strengths and weaknesses? The need of admiration you talk about is actually a weakness, a dependency on something external that leaves you vulnerable. I wonder if you can put an equal sign between weakness and depending on external things. I also wonder if this really matters; not only is trying to avoid all dependencies impossible, but it also makes you give up plenty of possibilities.
 

Member




Posts: 100
Registered: 13/2/2007
Status: Offline

  posted on 4/2/2008 at 11:39 AM
Poem? Song?
Enlighten me please.

 

____________________
[[Ive learned too many things to let life pass me by now. Ive grown up and learned my lessons, this is the beginning of the future]]

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 648
Registered: 24/9/2002
Status: Offline

  posted on 21/2/2008 at 11:51 PM
I recommend that you not say it is a poem. If you do, you'll see why.

 

____________________
"People always say what we are looking for is a meaning for life…I don't think that's what we're looking for. I think what we're looking for is the experience of being alive." -Joseph Campbell

 

Occasional Poster




Posts: 14
Registered: 18/8/2002
Status: Offline

  posted on 23/2/2008 at 07:46 PM
whether labeled so or not, it is a poem.
 

Member




Posts: 100
Registered: 13/2/2007
Status: Offline

  posted on 25/2/2008 at 10:23 AM
I recommend that you not say it is a poem. If you do, you'll see why.

Then:
whether labeled so or not, it is a poem.


Well then, MRD, could you enlighten him on why not? or why? whichever you prefer

 

____________________
[[Ive learned too many things to let life pass me by now. Ive grown up and
learned my lessons, this is the beginning of the future]]

 

Fanatic




Posts: 376
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 26/2/2008 at 04:31 PM
Actually it seemed a little more 'stream-of-thought' to me.

quote:
to fell pity is to understand what the weak is going through


I'd argue that pity might be rather condescending, and doesn't mean you understand what they experience.

quote:
Love your enemies, cause their llives are precious too, maybe not to us, but to somebody, the value of another being is important.


Again, I'd argue over your use of words. I do not, will not and can not love an enemy. You can show compassion towards them, if you are in a position to do so, because they are human too, but I don't see how anyone can profess to truly love their enemies.

quote:
When you are weakm the strong protect you


Do they?

quote:
the strong have a need, the strong has to have someone to admire them


Umm, no. I'd say that if you need the admiration of others, you are weak yourself.

 

____________________
Do not fear death so much, but rather the inadequate life.

 

Occasional Poster




Posts: 20
Registered: 2/2/2008
Status: Offline

  posted on 27/2/2008 at 06:40 PM
quote:
Actually it seemed a little more 'stream-of-thought' to me.

probably was...

quote:
to fell pity is to understand what the weak is going through


I'd argue that pity might be rather condescending, and doesn't mean you understand what they experience.

I thought about it and perhaps I was searching for the right word, maybe the word is closer to empathy.
you make good points pixi

quote:
Love your enemies, cause their llives are precious too, maybe not to us, but to somebody, the value of another being is important.


Again, I'd argue over your use of words. I do not, will not and can not love an enemy. You can show compassion towards them, if you are in a position to do so, because they are human too, but I don't see how anyone can profess to truly love their enemies.

Hmm , enemies, you do not love your enemies, perhaps you are angry or indifferent?
you can love someone and hate what they do. I think love has to do with how you feel inside, so a person could love an enemy, it is the way they act and what they do that makes you not love them, not to justify it, but if you walked in their shoes, you might understand, even enemies have good qualities,,it's like a whole different world inside your enemies head. of course looking at the good qualities of an enemy can be positive or negative depending on the way you look at. you know the old saying keep your friends close, but your enemies closer. to make a foe a friend, know your enemy but some would say why bother. well so we can prevent tragedies for one thing. I probably don't make any sense.but oh well, better to be a fool, then to be thought wise, Fools don't have to prove anything, the wise Are forever debating who is the wiser. I saw a movie where one the characters is thought to be dumb, but he knew all along what was going on. Sorry for being a noisy idiot.

this might not have to do with it but How can some people forgive other people for hurting or killing a loved ones or friends and other people can't even forgive an insult?
Does forgiveness come from love, empathy, something else?

quote:
When you are weakm the strong protect you


Do they?

Ahh, Some do, some don't,

quote:
the strong have a need, the strong has to have someone to admire them


Umm, no. I'd say that if you need the admiration of others, you are weak yourself.


True Admiring someone blindly is a weakness, but I think their are traits , values and qualities to be admired in people. Admiring a person you like is alright, as long as you don't admire the wrong person., yes i do contradict myself sometimes.
sometimes I admire people, sometimes i don't.I admire my enemy's persistence, some times I like my enemy better than his equipment (Sp?) I like to collect all the pieces.
but I admire great thinkers, I admire brave people, I admire witty people but maybe because I lack witticism in myself, I could go on,

 

Fanatic




Posts: 376
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 28/2/2008 at 02:49 AM
quote:
Hmm , enemies, you do not love your enemies, perhaps you are angry or indifferent?


I don't think I know anyone at the moment who would really qualify as my 'enemy'. I mean, there are people that I dislike, but no-one worth calling an enemy. As for the people dislike, I think aside from the obvious feelings of dislike, they frustrate me - but that's about it.

quote:
you can love someone and hate what they do. I think love has to do with how you feel inside, so a person could love an enemy, it is the way they act and what they do that makes you not love them


But that's just it - why would an enemy evoke feelings of love in you? Surely by the very actions which cause you to label them as an enemy, they give you reason not to love them?

quote:
even enemies have good qualities,,it's like a whole different world inside your enemies head. of course looking at the good qualities of an enemy can be positive or negative depending on the way you look at.


Yes, they can have a great many positive points; you can respect their intelligence, or charisma, but being able to appreciate their good points surely won't change whatever it is about them that caused you to regard them as an enemy.

quote:
this might not have to do with it but How can some people forgive other people for hurting or killing a loved ones or friends and other people can't even forgive an insult?
Does forgiveness come from love, empathy, something else?


I guess it's a trade-off between how much you care about the person you're forgiving in relation to how much they hurt you, and whether or not you're ready to move on.

If your partner cheated on you, but professed a genuine remorse for their actions you might forgive them partly because you love them, and partly because their remorse would help you move past the pain they caused you.

quote:
True Admiring someone blindly is a weakness, but I think their are traits , values and qualities to be admired in people. Admiring a person you like is alright, as long as you don't admire the wrong person.


Ye-es, but you were talking about the need to be admired, not to admire someone else.

Anyway, I more or less agree with what you said in the above quote. Admiring someone is like saying that you recognise they have qualities A, B and C, and you think those qualities are desirable, or good. This is all well and good, provided you keep looking at it that way round; if you admire someone based on certain qualities they have, the fact of your admiration does not mean that all qualities that person has are equally desirable though.

Person X has quality A. You admire quality A, so you admire person X for that particular quality. Okay.

You admire person X. Person X has quality A, so you admire quality A because person X has it. Not okay.

 

____________________
Do not fear death so much, but rather the inadequate life.

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 1570
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 13/3/2008 at 12:23 AM
I hate with my whole heart. I love with my whole heart. I'm stingy with both, and I'd not do anyone the diservice of muddying the waters by going at it piecemeal. What I dont' hate/love about the person, I can learn to. I"m an adaptable ape. Straightforward gut emotion is so divine, I would hate (wholeheartedly!) to pull it apart and make it commonplace.

 

____________________
Trapped in time. Surrounded by evil. Low on gas.

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 648
Registered: 24/9/2002
Status: Offline

  posted on 28/3/2008 at 12:45 PM
quote:
I hate with my whole heart. I love with my whole heart. I'm stingy with both, and I'd not do anyone the diservice of muddying the waters by going at it piecemeal. What I dont' hate/love about the person, I can learn to. I"m an adaptable ape. Straightforward gut emotion is so divine, I would hate (wholeheartedly!) to pull it apart and make it commonplace.




I remember being told at some point in my life that if I was going to do something I should do it with my whole heart in it. Also, i was told, "Don't do a half ass job." Sounds about the same to me.

 

____________________
"People always say what we are looking for is a meaning for life…I don't
think that's what we're looking for. I think what we're looking for is the
experience of being alive." -Joseph Campbell

 

Coward




Posts: 4
Registered: 13/4/2008
Status: Offline

  posted on 13/4/2008 at 01:08 PM
Preciousness is relative. What I value may not be what you value. Not to go around trashing things wantonly because I don't have any use for them, but some people I just plain don't have any use for and I'm not going to pretend I do.

Everyone is "the weak" at some time or other, some more than others of course. I think it's a little pointless to categorize "the weak" like that. If you are pitying the weak, you are pitying yourself. And it doesn't mean you understand what "they" are going through. First step might be for you to try to understand what you are going through yourself - that's tricky enough for most people. I know that if I were having a weak moment, I'd get pretty damn ticked at someone for pitying me and pretending that meant they understood me.

Love my enemies? Yes and no. My enemy has value because they teach me to be strong. To be on my guard. Beyond that, if someone is my enemy it's because they have chosen to mess with me. To me, love is a very practical, active thing, and I'm not about to go wasting that kind of effort on someone who wants to deliberately mess with me when I could be giving it to someone who would return the favor. My enemies matter only as long as I am thwarting their efforts or learning from them, and then they can disappear into the shadows for all I care. I don't care who else values them - that's up to them. Not my concern.

When you are weak, the strong might protect you, but then again, they might not. Being weak happens to everyone, no biggie. But I'm not going to pretend it's good. It's not. It's dangerous. When I can, I purge weakness. When I can, I try to live like there is no strong person to protect me. And when I am weak and I do find a strong person giving me a hand, I make sure they get honor in return because they didn't have to. And I may need them later to come along and help me. But I will do my utmost not to need it.

The strong have it just the same as the weak, only they are in less danger. They may, or may not, have someone to come along and help at any given time. At the very least, the strong have themselves to turn to. Lonely, but it works in a pinch.

But once again, there is no "the strong" and "the weak". We are all strong sometimes and weak others. You can't categorize like that.

Admiration is relatively unimportant. When I am strong, it's not for the admiration. It's for survival. If someone admires me, great. I don't need it. I'd rather have a bond of mutual respect and giving with another strong person, with admiration as only a pleasant side effect.

As for no one caring about the in-between... what the hell is that supposed to mean? We are all in-between, at varying levels. I consider myself in-between, and I know several people who care very much.

In the end, it sounds all nice and poetical, but it has little ground in reality. That's my two cents.

 

Occasional Poster




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Registered: 2/2/2008
Status: Offline

  posted on 22/5/2008 at 05:20 PM
I am sorry, I didn't mean it to be saying that. the whole thing is kind of silly I guess., you all make good points.
I know that we are weak sometimes and strong in other times.

 
 


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