Though this topic may have been dabbled in here and there I haven’t really
seen a thread dedicated to sharing specifically the ideals of a afterlife
so here is one: Do you feel there’s a ensuing life after this one? What do
you think happens?
I know nothin' and I doubt anyone knows any facts of the matter anyhow, but
I have my hopes. I'm a big fan of reincarnation...when I finally kick it
for good, I'd like to start all over again...with no recollection of my
past sins or graces. Tabula Rasa.
I have a hard time believing in heaven...it sounds like a cop out to me.
But thats just me.
And a hell? Fuck...do enough bad things while your alive and you build
your own baby hell right inside of yourself, with you as the VIP.
I don't know...but there are days when I dream about starting over
completely.
All I do know is, when you get close to it...it can be really fucking
scary.
____________________ In the valley of the Goats, the Goat Fucker is King
Anya
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Posts: 656 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 31/7/2003 at 01:52 PM
Bettie: I see myself agreeing with you. There's a lot of people out there
that are trying to monopolize religion and there has been since the Dark
Ages. I'm not all up for that "give me money and you go to Heaven" thing.
What does money have to do with spiritual attainment? Ah well.
Anya
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Posts: 656 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 31/7/2003 at 01:48 PM
Call my ideas unpopular, but I believe that Purgatori/Purgatory is quite
similar to Reincarnation. From what my family understood it as, it is the
place where we correct mistakes and perfect ourself for Heaven. That's the
biggest idea surrounding Reincarnation according to a lot of sources.
I'm very skeptic about past life, but I do believe that we have a chance to
start over if we mess up. My mom does not believe in Reincarnation for she
thinks people will just mess up even more - I disagree for one, and if I
believe that of we completely start over good as new, how can we mess up
again and again? Once more, these are just my beliefs, but I do not see the
hurt in believing...even if we do just end up dying.
I measure my deeds on a Karmic scale...I cannot say if anyone else's Karma
is good or bad, nor can I say I am better than anyone else.
daria_4
Member
Posts: 96 Registered: 29/7/2003 Status: Offline
posted on 31/7/2003 at 01:02 PM
quote:I don't believe in the
idea of purgatory though. Didn't the church add purgatory to the
"afterlife" list as a way of attracting more followers since the ideal of
either going to Heaven or Hell turned away numbers too great?
I'm not sure if/why/when they added it, but I do remember hearing something
about using the idea as a way to get more money... As in, someone you love
dies, they go to purgatory, you give more money, we (the clergy) pray them
into heaven faster than we would have otherwise. I think that was one of
those things they did back in the Dark Ages, though. It's not something
I've heard of being practiced recently.
This is all hearsay on my part, though. I am neither Catholic, a
recovering--err, former Catholic, nor a scholar of religion(s).
____________________ "I've told you before, I don't comprehend religion, although
conviction is a concept I'm beginning to get. In any case, a person
with a real religious conviction is, I propose, a religious convict,
and deserves locking up."
AloneSoul
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Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
posted on 31/7/2003 at 12:48 AM
*can't sleep*
I feel as though when we die there are sorts of other "worlds" we can go
to. We can be stuck in limbo {Earth}, "Heaven" or "Hell." Keep in mind that
I was born and raised a christian and even though I don't follow
Christianity I still see the afterlife in those sorts of things.
I don't believe in the idea of purgatory though. Didn't the church add
purgatory to the "afterlife" list as a way of attracting more followers
since the ideal of either going to Heaven or Hell turned away numbers too
great?
All I hope is that the next life will be peaceful, filled with sleep and
comfy beds...and that you can reunited with those you’ve lost.
When I die, I want to hang around and haunt the place. And I want to go the
whole nine yards with it, rattling chains, ghastly noises, hallways that
stretch on forever, creepy clown dolls under the bed, writing obscure stuff
on mirrors. I think it sounds like loads of fun.
Pending that, I'll probably just end up sitting around on my ass. As in
life, so in death, or so someone whose black was blacker than my blackest
black once told me.
____________________ Okay, dazzle me.
daria_4
Member
Posts: 96 Registered: 29/7/2003 Status: Offline
posted on 30/7/2003 at 06:01 PM
I'm not sure that I hold a particular belief concerning another existance
beyond the one I'm locked into at the moment.
I do have some hopes for it--not that I want to "live forever," though. If
there is an afterlife, I only hope that one's "soul" (to use a familiar
term) has the option to end. To quit, as it were. In much the same way that
believing in life everlasting (in any myriad of forms) is comforting to
some, the idea of oblivion gives me that same little warm fuzzy inside.
I like what Schizo said about maybe getting a choice. It reminds me of the
atheist from On a Pale Horse whose soul simply dissipated in the
hands of Thanatos rather than going on to Heaven, Hell, or Purgatory. I
certainly hope I dissolve out of "being" completely.
____________________ "I've told you before, I don't comprehend religion, although conviction is a concept I'm beginning to get. In any case, a
person
with a real religious conviction is, I propose, a religious
convict,
and deserves locking up."
Schizo
Extreme Fanatic
Posts: 897 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 30/7/2003 at 05:25 PM
Good to see you posting, Rogue! You've been pretty quiet lately. We've
missed you.
I like your notions about afterlife.
Maybe you get a choice of what kind of afterlife you get. If you're into
heaven, then heaven. If you want another shot, then reincarnation. I
personally would like to be a ghost for a while, and check up on people,
and make some interesting stories for my still-alive friends to tell each
other before I move on to another life.
And maybe those poor souls who want to end it all truly get to, instead of
going from the frying pan straight into the fiery pit, like I was always
taught.
But I think more likely they get another life, and another chance to learn
the lesson they should have learned from the life they threw away. That
seems more fitting.
____________________ "You can tell by the scars on my arms and the cracks in my hips and the
dents in my car and the blisters on my lips that I'm not the carefullest of
girls." - Dresden Dolls, "Girl Anachronism"
Rogue
Member
Posts: 199 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 30/7/2003 at 01:08 PM
My worthless experience and opinions follow:
There is something that makes a being a being and not just an animated
body, and this thing is not lost when the thing we call death occurs. I
met my grandfather ten years after his death when I was five, and prior to
seeing any pictures of him. I think there are many options available
including reincarnation, dissolution, and a form of rapture which I
consider to be a merging with the universal collective consciousness. Call
it Akashic records, God, Cthulhu, or Warm Brie, it doesn't matter.
My experience with life after death is that it is a lot like life before
death except that people look at you funny afterwards and pretend to care
about your feelings all of a sudden while religiously avoiding the taboo
subject of your death itself and the associated thoughts or emotions. It's
like those touchy-feely bastards that oozed like slime from the Littleton
woodwork after people got shot, the same ones that were previously too
caught up in parking their Lexus SUVs illegally in the lot next to the
Cherry Creek Mall and having the selfish gall to suggest that the owner of
said lot had no right to put the Denver Boot on their car.
Life during death can be cool or suck, depending on your attitude (i.e. do
you feel bad about anything you did) and independent of any external
morality. It's a lot like acid in that regard, what kind of trip you have
is dependent on whether you are a drama qaween or a chill monkey.
The trick to all this shit is to live instead of waiting for death, because
death has a big cock and is into anal.
Sorry for the bluntness and all that, flame me if you don't like it.
AloneSoul
Fanatic
Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
posted on 30/7/2003 at 12:36 PM
Scientism can be welcome when you pinpoint the facts but when you don't it
must be a very cold religion to follow.
Aye, sometimes in a debate science and things such as the paranormal can
clash, co-exist...whatever word you choose but now at least is the time to
go on your principles of faith...
If your faith is in science then go for it. If religion, go for it. If
none, go for it.
f">
HREF="http://www.pathetic.org/library.php?i_memberid=2042">
size=1> but at least you know, just how much pain there is in living
Monolycus
Fanatic
Posts: 580 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 27/7/2003 at 01:59 PM
Thank you, Schiz. You beat me to that punch. Science (as an extension of
natural philosphy) is restricted in its purview to that which is both
observable and repeatable. The branch of science called biology can
explain the simple fact that you have children. The branch of science
called mathematics can explain the simple fact that you have a finite
number of children. The branch of science called physics can explain the
simple fact that your child stumbled and scraped their knee. But no branch
of science can demonstrate the simple fact that you love your child. I
wouldn't look to science for the answers about the afterlife; there is
plenty in the here and now that science is not equipped to answer.
While science might have narrow and specific parameters, scientism does
not. Scientism (not to be confused with Scientology) is the slavish belief
that nothing lies outside the range of scientific discipline, which can
explain anything and everything; scientists are infallible and that their
words carry more weight than any laymen, and that the human race knows more
now than it ever has (it doesn't). Science can be an invaluable tool
within its own limitations, but Scientism makes science into a sacred cow
and scientists into the high priests of an unpopular religion.
~M.
Schizo
Extreme Fanatic
Posts: 897 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 27/7/2003 at 06:04 AM
The problem with science is that it can only (by definition) deal with what
is observable and repeatable. Hence, the scientific method, with it's
progression from hypothesis, to theory in testing, to fact. Some things
just don't fall well under that category.
History, for example, often deals with things that cannot be tested under
the scientific method. History deals with documentation, and ways of
testing that ascertain whether a certain document is valid and worthy of
trust. Science my be used in the process (for example, to test wether the
document was actually from the time period claimed), but some things in
history are completely unprovable scientifically. For example, did Lincoln
actually give the Gettysburg address? The proof is completely contained in
A. the written manuscript of the address, B. the written accounts of the
event, C. accounts passed down by word of mouth, and D. any photographs
that may exist of Lincoln at Gettysburg.
You can observe the present through science. You can document the past
through history. But how can you tell what will happen in the future?
What is there about the presence of any kind of afterlife that can be
tested or documented? Science and history is next to useless in this
circumstance.
____________________ "You can tell by the scars on my arms and the cracks in my hips and the
dents in my car and the blisters on my lips that I'm not the carefullest
of
girls." - Dresden Dolls, "Girl Anachronism"
dead-cell
Fanatic
Posts: 344 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 26/7/2003 at 07:14 PM
All I can offer are my hopes/ beliefs on an after life (if there is one).
The thing about science is to remember it is still young. If all there is,
is science; then I look forward to resting all my muscles and nerves to
complete the circle. If heaven (if we can choose what our heaven looks
like): grassy hills, trees here and there, majestic mountains, 60-70 degree
weather, and most importantly a big blue sky with white fluffy clouds. If
hell: a four walled cubicle, fluorescent lights and all. If reincarnation:
a dog, or a tree (again if I can choose). If continued consciousness
(a.k.a. no longer bound to flesh): I would like to drift the universe.
Visit mars, the rings of Saturn, alien stars.
____________________ co-worker: "Your gay!?"
myself: "Didn't you see my rainbow pin?"
co-worker: "I just thought you liked skettles."
-(yes, it actually happened to me)
Anya
Extreme Fanatic
Posts: 656 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 26/7/2003 at 05:46 PM
I think science is a good way to approach, as well. When I look at
doctrines and myths, science usually comes first. What I was pointing out
was that nothing explains beyond, which may be one of those things we will
not know about at all. But I probably did have the wrong interpretation.
Human mistake, my bad.
[Edited on 7/27/2003 by Anya]
Monolycus
Fanatic
Posts: 580 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 25/7/2003 at 11:36 PM
I've got my hands too full with this life to worry about how I'm going to
screw up the next one.
~M.
Sticupus
Fanatic
Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 25/7/2003 at 10:35 PM
Actually I think Science is the best approach. It sets standards for
procedure and allows change. You had a wrong interpretation, I'm sorry.
____________________ The OBOLISK is Divine.
Anya
Extreme Fanatic
Posts: 656 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 25/7/2003 at 10:25 PM
It is true that there's a lot of unanswered questions in life. Science is
a nice system, but it never explains what is beyond - I can say the same
for a lot of religion (what was there before God? etc?). I just refuse to
believe that the WHOLE truth is in one single book, hence my eclectic
tendencies.
There was something I forgot to mention in my other post. I believe in
those three things for I personally dealt with a "Hellish" mindset when
doing things that I know that I did not want done on myself. The
"Heavenly" mindset usually comes when I feel what I would call "Balanced."
Whether or not that will happen in the afterlife, I believe it may be, but
I also adopt some agnosticism in the concept: who knows?
My beliefs may be right, my beliefs may be wrong. Like everyone else, I'm
human and prone to error and like everyone else, I'll likely find out in
the 'next life.'
Sticupus: I just read that article you posted the link for not so long ago
- I actually enjoyed it. A lot of people outright insist that science is
all the answers, but I find that arrogant...as much as I find it arrogant
for Bible thumpers to think that they know it all for they believe in a
single book. Again, this is coming from an opinionated person [me].
Alugarde
Member
Posts: 185 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 25/7/2003 at 09:46 PM
O.O
[Edited on 7/26/2003 by Alugarde]
____________________ l33t is the bastard cousin of contractions.
Sticupus
Fanatic
Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
posted on 25/7/2003 at 09:37 PM
Henry David Thoreau's last two words were "Moose... Indian......"