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| Articles: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck? |
Posted by
Domkitten on Friday, February 28, 2003 - 02:37 PM PST
“Why do you want to be an embalmer? “
“Because of the bodies. “
“What do you mean? “
“I make love to them. “
“Really? “
“Yeah... dead bodies. “ –From Lynne Stopkewich's Kissed
I would say it was about 1 am. I was channel surfing while I was painting. When I paint I like to watch bad T.V. There is something I find inspiring about bad T.V. For me it always makes good art, because, if I want to be entertained while watching bad T.V. it is pretty much up to me to make the entertainment.
One of the interesting things about Korea is that they show movies here all the time. I get to see all sorts of crazy stuff, with no commercial interruptions. It’s like having HBO for free. Rather nifty when you get down to it.
It was about 1 am and I was looking for something in English to watch while I was painting and I stumbled upon this strange movie where, after listening for a few seconds, I was convinced that the characters were talking about corpses.
I was not to be disappointed, as the movie continued, I lost interest entirely in the pieces that I was creating, because I was fascinated and a wee bit disgusted by the movie I had found, called simply Kissed.
The main character Sandra is in love with death. Not the concept of death or dying, or a need to kill herself or inflict harm. She is in love with the dead, and indeed makes love to them. She is learning to become an embalmer because she is fascinated with death and needs to be close to it in a way that is sexual in nature. Sandra says
“It was like diving into a light... suddenly cold, and silence. Their bodies floated, solemn and shimmering. I watched their lives flow out-- who they were, what they've done. My hands burned like I was touching dry ice. And all I could see was the light... I looked right into it.”
Alas for Sandra she becomes the object of desire and pursuit of a classmate, Mark, who is obsessed with her obsession with death. He cannot understand it, wants to become it. He tries to entice her to make love to him while he lies completely still, clothed in his best suit, wearing make-up. He tries to understand it from the position of the corpse. He wants to watch Sandra with the dead, and even, in a last attempt to make love to the dead himself as a way of understanding her, and showing Sandra his love.
At 1 am a number of things will go through your mind when watching two people talk passionately about corpses. I wondered if this desire to possess the dead sexually would really fall into the category of Goth.
An interesting thing about the movie representation of this is Sandra’s love of the “stillness” of the bodies. When Matt pretends to be dead he cannot become as quiet and as still as a corpse and so he fails in his attempt to offer himself to Sandra dead while still living.
I’ve discussed fantasy and sexuality and the subject of necrophilia has of course come to the top of the discussion more than once. I’ve heard one girl describe being placed in a bathtub full of ice so she could play dead for her boyfriend. I found it weird, but not nearly as disturbing as the representation I watched last night.
Kissed is not a Goth movie and yet it is. Sandra does not dress in black, she is not abnormal in look or appearance. She is not overwhelming beautiful or ugly. She is average, normal. Her only deviation is her love for the dead. Matt stops her once when she comes to his apartment for their nightly tryst. He grabs her hands and says, “There’s still blood under your nails”. Sandra later complains that his apartment is too noisy, too warm. Unspoken is the comparison she is making between the apartment and the morgue, where her real lovers rest.
What makes this movie so fascinating is it’s rather frank and stark portrayal of this female necrophile. She is not spectacular or amazing in any way. Perhaps this is because her character is underdeveloped, or because as an audience we do not spend enough time with her (the movie is only 80 minutes long).
And so I found myself wondering after this, is Necrophilia goth as fuck. Death, blood, blackness, and orgasm are some of the key components of Gothos. However the true connoisseur, one who must really love the dead, would they? could they? ever really be Goth? Or, because of their addiction to the dead, are they not more Goth than we could ever hope to be?
Online Reviews:
Fuck Death
Kissed
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Average Rating : 3.4
Total ratings : 5
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| Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck? | Login/Create an account | 35 Comments |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Devin (devin-at-vibechild-dot-com)
on Feb 28, 2003 - 02:43 PM
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This reminds me of the "Suicide Girl" part of the Sexy Losers comic
http://sexylosers.keenspace.com/007.html
You might have to flip through a bunch of them to see what I'm saying - but it's worth your time. Especially if you're having Flem comics withdrawals.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Merry_Widow on Feb 28, 2003 - 02:55 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | "Well, if you're going to be that way...I'll meet you at the bottom!" *click click*
The line starts at number 5 or 7, I can't remember. If you find just one of the comics in a particular story line, it will hunt them all out for you. |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com)
on Mar 01, 2003 - 03:35 AM
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GOD this reminds me of a short story I read a while ago, I dont' know the name of it, the author, or the exact story line but it was SO like this.
It's about a queen who is arranged to marry this king guy or something, but he won't touch her AT ALL, and when he does he forces her to stand naked in the cold air by the window until she's chilled to the bone, then make her lay perfectly still while he fucks her. No sound, no movement, pretty much made her "play dead". I think she ended up killing him. I wish I could remember the author. It's in a book of short horror stories, I'll see if I can find it.
I think if they'd made the girl overtly bizarre or "goth" it would have taken away from the movie, as come one....we all know the line from stunned neighbors on the news when there is a cannibal/serialkiller/sicko caught: "I never would have guessed/they were so normal/nice guy, great to my kids etc" Wierdos and sickos aren't OBVIOUS...they're as "normal" as "normal" gets...ambiguous, chameleons almost, because if they WEREN'T they would be spotted and be eyed all the time and their illness or craziness would be caught before it came to full frutition. Wierd how that works huh?
In my personal opinion it's NOT goth as fuck (except for in very sick very funny cartoons or comic strips, because hey, I get a kick out of it, but not when it's REAL *EW*), it is in my OPINION.....grody, with a capitol G and lots of barfy sounds inbetween.
I guess in theory, of course, it WOULD be, but if it were the case (as well as so many other "goth as fuck" ideals) then goths would be MESSED UP MOFOS.
I should find it and watch it. I'm up for something icky/interesting.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Domkitten (domkittenish@spanking.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 01:59 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | Actually the way in which this is done makes it so it doesn't come off as icky at all, which is probably one of the reasons I found this movie so distrubing. I actually could sympathize with the character. That was creepy.
I'm not sure which short story that is, but if you haven't you might try reading the Blood Countess by Andrea Cordrusc (I'm sure I spelled that wrong). An excellent book with a similiar sort of scene. |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 04:09 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | Eh I gotta look it up, it wasn't the book you mentioned tho, it was in a short story comp book.
See, that's what would be so creepy about a movie like that...making it appear so UN-ICKY.
Eh, I haven't seen anything that made me uneasy for a long long time. I'm game. I'm gonna try to find it :) |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by gothicmorman (litty_klj@hotmail.com)
on Mar 01, 2003 - 05:42 AM
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i would just like to comment on the second review -
"However, "Kissed" did fail in one respect-- helping the audience to understand the basis for Sandra's necrophilic tendencies. At the opening of the film, her obsession with death has already taken root and no exposition is provided as to why it has such a hold on her. Aside from morbid curiosity, what motivates her? What in the living world does Sandra find so discomforting that she must find comfort with the dead? More background on this seemingly-complex character would have created a more sympathetic narrative, perhaps even to the point of universalizing her struggle for the audience. "
those questions dont seem to be something they could really explain to the audience, you kind of have to figure it out yourself...
on another note, good question it sounds like cool movie...
the ruthless
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Domkitten (domkittenish@spanking.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 01:55 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | Well for me the question is more really is having physical sexual contact with the dead goth? I find that more pressing then Sandra's interest in the dead or need to be with the dead. I can actually understand myself what might draw her to this. Aside from power, and control, and the feeling that she is helping the soul to accept a final release.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by gothicmorman (litty_klj@hotmail.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 02:34 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | yah i did refer to both questions one can see how that might have been confusing thogh...
maybe we should have a vote on whether it is goth a fuck or not...
the ruthless |
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Kissed
by IamSquid (undisclosed)
on Mar 01, 2003 - 06:14 PM
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I enjoyed this paticular movie but I found that the ending deformulated the my impression of the movie's flavor.
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Re: Kissed
by Domkitten (domkittenish@spanking.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 02:09 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | Yes, the ending alas only felt predictable, but at the same time it fit with the development of the story line and the characters. I don't know.
To be honest I'd like to see it again from the begining, as I missed about 10 minutes of the exposition.
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Re: Kissed
by IamSquid (undisclosed) on Mar 02, 2003 - 07:26 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | I understand the point was how in love with her he was but I mean come on...
The beginning is not that interesting, it's just her as a kid |
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Re: Necrophila Vote
by Domkitten (domkittenish@spanking.com)
on Mar 02, 2003 - 06:29 AM
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Alright, necrophila, the real down and dirty nasty doing it with a corpse. Not fake, not blood play, not fantasy, not acting, but going to a morgue and getting it on with an honest to god dead body. Goth as fuck? Yes or No. Come on people, vote by replying with your yeah or nea and we can count them up.
Think about this and include reasons for why it is or isn't goth as fuck.
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Re: My Vote.
by Domkitten (domkittenish@spanking.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 06:32 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | I figure I should kick this off.
Yea
I think it is, in fact, goth as fuck. An honest to god necrophilac would probably say they were not goth, hence denial, so, there you are. Plus hanging out in a morgue after hours to get off with dead bodies just strikes me as uber goth, regardless of how icky, or how little I want to do it.
Sorta like walking about in a dead man's shoes, only morso. |
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Re: Necrophila Vote
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com) on Mar 02, 2003 - 07:01 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://http:// | Yes, I think necrophilia is goth as fuck. However, I think that a great number of "goths" into necrophilia are about as genuine as the ones who are obsessed with vampires. True necrophiliacs are few and far between, and the more you boast about it, the less likely you are to be genuine.
When I read this article, I thought to myself, could I ever do this? Could I ever be in a situation where I would seriously consider necrophilia?
I came to the conclusion that, yes, I might. Probably not, but perhaps.
I remember the only dead person I ever saw before it had been all smeared with makeup and shit at the funeral home. It was my favorite uncle, who had died of colon cancer while I was sleeping in the room above.
I went into the room and saw him there. He was lying on the hospital-style bed on his back, wearing a shirt and shorts, barefooted. His skin was waxy pale, as if it had never known sun or blood. One eye wouldn't close all the way. The expression on his face was calm, dignified, and distant, and horribly vulnerable. I stared and stared, fascinated, and a little afraid. It took a while to gather up the courage to touch his hand, not because I was disgusted, but because it seemed too sacred, as if a touch would profane it with the infection called life. My uncle's body had been cleansed.
Thinking of that, realizing the great tenderness and almost worship I felt for the dead body of my uncle, I wonder what I would feel for the dead body of my lover. If he were to die, unmutilated and calm, and only he and I were there, would I love him one last time? If that tenderness and reverence were mixed with the last lingering passion held for that body and the spirit that once lived in it, would I do that? I can't say for certain that I wouldn't. Necrophilia sounds like such a cold and clinical word for truly saying my last farewell to a body that in life had been my entire world.
Then again, maybe, as I felt with my uncle, the contamination of my own life would be a barrier, and I would only think, and look, and maybe briefly touch. I don't know.
Who can know for sure, until they are actually there, with the decision before them?
Am I disgusting? Am I completely sick for thinking this? Perhaps. And perhaps, I am simply being perfectly honest. I wonder how many people have been confronted with the corpse of their lover, and been tempted, and turned away because their minds had been programmed to consider it vile and unnatural. People who would never admit their temptation to a soul, even to themselves, forever afterward.
Am I goth as fuck? Perhaps in this area. I really don't care. I'm just trying to be truthful with myself. |
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Re: Necrophila Vote
by KatB on Mar 02, 2003 - 10:45 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.magicka.net | Ney...
I agree with Feralucce on this subject.
Not giving a fuck regarding what/who/how people fuck is goth as fuck.
My two fucking cents.
;-p |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by feralucce on Mar 02, 2003 - 08:45 AM
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I do not think so... Most of the things associated with the gothic lifestyle are an active life choice. Fetishes... are not a choice... any-phile, had no choice in what they are doing... the physical reaction is hard wired into them. almost instinctual. The Gothic lifestyle is about embracing the path you choose... not conforming to what you must nececssarily be...
Feral
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by AloneSoul (AloneSoul@hurting.com)
on Mar 02, 2003 - 05:23 PM
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This reminds me of a movie: Dead-Alive.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Anya on Mar 02, 2003 - 11:15 PM
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Interesting. I don't think I'd consider Necrophilia much of a Goth trait, though. As callei's detailed article on "What Makes You Goth" says - someone who likes the dead could be Goth, but it isn't what makes them Goth.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Dolorosa (SixOfSwords@IU.zzn.com)
on Mar 03, 2003 - 02:15 PM
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Ah, personally...Necrophilia is interesting, but not really my thing...during sex, I expect to get bit, chewed, bruised and well...fucked...and if a dead person is doing that, then some baaaaad george romero shit is going down.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by VladII (vladII@seznam.cz)
on Mar 13, 2003 - 01:58 AM
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oh, this movie sounds really interesting. but is the necrophilia goth as fuck?
yes, i see there some elements which seems gothic, but i think if you want to be goth you do not need to practice necrophilia.
i do not know what to think about it . we live in (usually) democratic states, but is this legal ? if i imagine that someone do thi things with MY dead body---NO!
so i think necrophilia is not a good "thing", in some another practises there is some place for free will of the secon person but here not. so necrphilia is not goth as fuck.
(my opinion)
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by GothicVampire (maestuscorvus@hotmail.com)
on Mar 21, 2003 - 12:27 PM
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I will agree with Feral on that. Goth is about choosing your own way throught life. Giving into some philias is not goth at all. Also I will disagree with Domkitten that goth is about blood, death and orgasms. Hey, if it was like that then we all goths should be out there having orgies, making sacrifices and cutting our veins. And that would make us just another bunch of psychos, and we are not psychos are we? I find death interesting and charming because it is something I haven't explored yet but I am not willing to explore it before my time has come. I don't find the need to make love to the dead a way to explore death or anything like that. I just find it as a need to express your own sexual dominative sick nature. Love is about creating life and uniting life. Love with the dead is not love. So my point is just necrophilia is NOT goth as fuck.
- Goth_Vamp
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Domkitten (saradevil@saradevil.com) on Mar 22, 2003 - 03:19 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.saradevil.com | Actually, I said that blood, death and orgasm are componenets, not defining traits of Goth. Goth is or isn't what people will make it. I simply raise the question of how "oh so Goth" is necrophila?
If you are making love to the dead, seriously, you must make a choice first to love the body. Sandra is interested in releasing the soul from the body and helping to guide it towards whatever is "out there" after life ends. I found that profoundly moving. I think that in many ways her relationship with the dead is more wholly fullfilling than the same relationship with the living.
Who said love is about creating life and uniting life? If that were true everytime I fell in love I'd be spitting out babies, and the good gods know that is not true. Love is what you make of it.
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Malificent on Mar 21, 2003 - 03:45 PM
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Is it me...or did this end up rather like one of the many "What is Goth" articles?
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Domkitten (saradevil@saradevil.com) on Mar 22, 2003 - 03:13 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.saradevil.com | Well, seeing as how this article started out with the question of whether or not necrophila is goth, I suppose that yes it did end up that way. However, it was not meant as a question on what is or isn't goth, more of an article with interest in the aspects of necrophila and their relation to gothness.
Now that I have typed an insiped answer to the question I'll leave it be. |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Lacrimosa on Mar 22, 2003 - 10:32 AM
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I cannot see in which way necrophilia can be related to goths/gothic. Well...dead lovers does not sound goth-like to me, after all gothic isn't all about death. I think that this kind of perversion has nothing to do with gothness, it sounds to me like all other perversions such as zoophilia, paedofilia.
I do agree that death, blood, blackness and orgasm are connected to gothicism...don't be afraid of Death, don't get dizzy at the sight of blood, let blackness exist in your life, have as many orgasms as you want...but...for Goth's sake!!...do you have to make love to a dead just to feel the gothness in your life??
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com) on Mar 24, 2003 - 05:32 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://http:// | Some people might call polyamoury, bisexuality, homosexuality, etc. perversions. Much of the goth lifestyle IS about exploring (at least mentally) those things labelled by mainstream society as "perversions". Perhaps, even, discovering that they are not indeed perversions, just labelled so by those who are afraid to accept a way different than their own.
In other words, "goths' do not jump to conclusions.
Personally, I believe sex should be consensual, and after that, it's up to the people involved what they want to do. However, children are not old enough to make that kind of decision for themselves. Animals are not capable of making that decision. Therefore, it would indeed be perverted to have sex with a child or animal, thus robbing them of their free will.
Corpses, also, cannot choose whether or not to have sex with someone. However, someone in a close relationship with the corpse while it was still alive might possess the knowledge whether or not the body, while in life, would have agreed to such an act. If one were unaware of a person's feelings on the matter, or knew it wouldn't like it, indulging in necrophilia would be violation.
But what if the person knew the dead individual would be OK with it? Would it then be truly perverted? Or would it merely be considered so by the majority of our culture, simply because the act lies outside of their comfort zone?
I would not want a stranger to fuck my expired body, but if my boyfriend really wanted to, I would be completely fine with it. |
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Re: Is Necrophilia Goth as Fuck?
by I-Dont-NO on Jul 20, 2003 - 01:35 PM
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i gess its the best way you can get a orgassum if thats what dose it for you then go ahead. I wouldnt be wrong to trying it in all but it al ldeapends on the mood seting and the way the persons mind works. Yea it is goth though but i think it also can not be goth because i bet soem people that are not goth still would do it
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