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| Articles: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more? |
Posted by
firefly7 on Sunday, June 09, 2002 - 04:22 AM PST
"Bi guys are gross, it's just not right. Now bi girls, on the other hand, are great! What guy wouldn't love to have two girls in bed with him? Plus if he got tired he could just watch them going at it..." At this point, I slapped him.
"What was that for?! What I say, what I do?" I glared at him icily.
"That's awful Colin, I can't believe you." He looks at me and says; of all things...
"Since when are you bi?"
I mean come on now WHAT THE FUCK!?! If I am bi, it most certainly isn't any of his business.
Then he had the nerve to keep going.
"Now gay guys are something else I have a problem with. I mean two guys making out, or having sex, now that is just sick! Sick!" I look at him steadily.
"And why is that? I mean it's certainly no worse than two girls "going at it", now is it? He looks amazed that I don't understand his point of view. I mean come on now...
"Because girls are hot! Are you Fucking stupid?! Guys are just, ugh..." He shudders, and then smiles at me.
"Get it now?" I nod. Of course I get it.
"Homophobic. That's what you are." He shrugs.
"Just about guys." Yeah right, I bet if he ever met a lesbian, he'd freak and piss his pants or something. He's like that.
Last night my mom found out that my best friend has been asked out by a very nice, smart guy who just happens to be bi, and she said;
"Would YOU like to date some one who had feelings for members of the same gender?" I was shocked; I mean my mom is usually one of the least discriminative people I know. I was just at a loss for words for a moment.
"If they were a nice, intelligent person who I shared common interests with then yes, I would." She just nodded. I think the world around me has gone a little bit mad.
I have a friend who is very into the bible and God and all that stuff- which I am definitely not. She tells me that she can't be friends with gay people because there is some sort of something about it in the bible. And, she said something like "If you pray than you won't be homosexual. God will help you over come your feelings."
I mean, if I were bi would they all suddenly change their opinions of me? I wonder. I mean of all the things you that could have problems with, sexual orientation. What is the world coming to? *sighs* I want some chocolate...
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| Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more? | Login/Create an account | 44 Comments |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Schizo on Jun 09, 2002 - 05:00 AM
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I can deal with a guy preferring a threesome with two girls rather than a guy and a girl, but I agree, Colin has gone past the line of personal preference and delved into homophobia.
As for your Christian friend, yes, the Bible does call homosexuality a sin. And if you're going to believe the Bible, you're going to end up believing that too. But nowhere does it say you can't be friends with someone who sins. Hell, Jesus was described as a friend of sinners, after all, and aren't Christians supposed to be like Jesus? And if you could remove a sin just by praying, I know a lot of people who ought to be perfect now, but they sure as hell aren't! It's not as simple as that.
Anyway, thinking back, I think most of the references to homosexuality are in Paul's letters (I ought to double check, but I'm too lazy) and I really don't think that some guy's letters ought to be counted on the same level as the Word of God. Not that I pay that much attention to the Bible, anyway. I figure, if it's really true, then real life ought to bear it out. So I just live life and see what happens.
Anyway, I'm a Christian (or ex-Christian, or sort-of-Christian, or something, at least I was raised that way) and I don't really give a damn who anyone sleeps with, except maybe the B.F. I must admit I'm a little pickier there...
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 10, 2002 - 07:27 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | ...it's hard to give up the territorial urges. The bible says that witchcraft is an abomination as well (along with homosexuality of certain types, it's actually specific about what types, and doing any kind of work including lighting fires on the sabbath...) but realistically few people abide by all the rules and of those few people incur the requisite death sentence. Do what is right for you in the end, no book or person can tell you what is right for your situation because quite frankly there are things that we deal with on a daily basis that are just not addressed or addressable by any information source but the one in your brain pan. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law, thou art sovereign unto yourself and to thine own self be true. There, I've said it again. (name that tune) |
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Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any
by Schizo on Jun 11, 2002 - 12:37 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | Yeah, I get really annoyed by the people who claim to take the Old Testament and live it. Pretty much they just take certain parts of the law that they like, and leave out the parts they don't like, or wouldn't really work nowadays (like sacrificing animals or killing lawbreakers). I think it makes more sense to say, either it applies and we have to do everything, including sacrifices and executions, or else it was just a code of laws for a specific nation at a specific time in a specific place, and that's that.
I grew up having to keep the Sabbath sundown Friday to sundown Saturday (I actually like doing that, when I bother, which is seldom) and keeping the old dietary laws (which I don't do anymore. Mmmm bacon!)
As for sin, if you even want to use that word, I think it applies to things that fuck up yourself or other people. And it's a little different for different people. Somewhere or other there's a verse that goes something like "Love God with all your heart, soul, and mind, and love your neighbor as yourself. On this hangs the whole law and prophets." I try to do that, and let the specifics work themselves out. And you know what? I haven't had a single urge to kill any homosexuals! Or even hurt any! Hell, I've got a gay friend or two, anyway!
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 12, 2002 - 08:11 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | If you read the fine print and context, most of it is only for priests or Nazirites (like Samson, you can't cut your hair) and not the people as a whole. Besides that, most of it is only for the land of Israel, which we assume is on the present location of the country by the same name.
Besides that, there are only seven commandments that apply to everyone and one of those is to make a legal system for yourself, which is basically what you said unless I am smoking too much jimson weed lately.
The seven are common sense and easy to follow, most people follow them anyway. You could argue technicalities all day, like if I bed down with a guy it is okay as long as I do it as we are both men and not as if one of us were a woman...thus I am not lying with a man as with a woman... Nevermind that vowel-less Hebrew can mean anything you want it to mean and so any English version is just one of thousands of correct versions...
Schizo, you seem to really get the point of it all somehow, as if the brainwashing techniques or other indoctrination attempts did not work on you, and that is good to see. Brainwashing didn't work on me of course, on account of my mind being dirty to the core. |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a differe
by Schizo on Jun 13, 2002 - 04:26 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Hooray for the saving power of a dirty mind! |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a differe
by ComteStGermain on Jun 13, 2002 - 09:40 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Our eternal gratitude to you for once again dryly overexplaining the answer to a question no-one asked. Perhaps someday you should open a dictionary and pay close attention to the definition of "sanctimonious". |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a dif
by Schizo on Jun 14, 2002 - 06:22 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | Can you have a dirty mind and still be sanctimonious?
We like Rogue! Nyaaaah! |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 14, 2002 - 08:33 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | Yeah, Nyaaaah! Besides, if I were sanctimonious I would have to pretend to be pious, and I have never been accused of that. Dirty lecher is one of the more common things I get called, and the rest of my pet names cannot be repeated without putting an AVS on this site. :-D
Relax and have a good time here, we tend to hug the nice ones and smack the mean ones. |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is ther
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 14, 2002 - 10:27 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Do you need a hug, Devin? This is the right forum for it, you know. Lemme get on the phone, and I'll send a barista bearing currants over directly. |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is ther
by Schizo on Jun 15, 2002 - 04:44 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | *hugs Rogue and Devin*
Is it OK to hug God? |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by DevilBunny (land_of_nod@poczta.onet.pl)
on Jun 09, 2002 - 08:05 AM
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Well, obviously Colin went way out of the line. He says that he has nothing against "bi" girls, probably because he'd like two have sex with two not one. Typically male.
I think the most important thin is that two people like what they are doing. If you are a guy and prefer men, and you find someone with the same "orientation", hell, that's great, if you're happy with each other. Because that's what it's about, right?
Now onwards, to the Bible girl... assuming there is a God, like described in the Bible. I doubt He cares about your sexual orientation. Love, that's what is important. And that is in the Bible. God will not change "your feelings", in fact I think he would assure you that what you are doing is right, as long as it's not hurting anyone. Because He gave humans a free will, and that goes to sex, too. It were the people who wrote the Bible that made up all those silly rules. A true Christian needs only the words of Christ to live a good life. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but Christ said nothing about sex. orientation.
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Alugarde (SoulCiphyr@aol.com)
on Jun 09, 2002 - 09:35 AM
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Perhaps you should pretend to come out for a while and see who your real friends are?
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 10, 2002 - 07:27 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Come out, come out, wherever you are!!! |
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Dolorosa on Jun 20, 2002 - 06:09 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | *Chokes on his drink* |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people.
by Zander (zandriod@aagothic.net)
on Jun 09, 2002 - 03:08 PM
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sounds like your friend collin is having some homosexual thoughts bumping around in his head. So he's lacing his speach with Extra testosterone to try and cover that up in fear of ridicule.
then again he could just be a dumb-ass.
I'm tri-sexual. *just kidding*
but seriously if you begin to notice that you are finding other men attractive than god is making you gay and praying to the church won't help!
The fact that your friend collin finds gay women attractive and not men is sexist bullshit.
Cause remember, he didn't say that two guys kissing was gross to SEE he said it was gross and wrong period.
Some people are to good for death.
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people.
by Anya (-) on Jun 09, 2002 - 03:46 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | I have no problem with Homosexuals or Bi-Sexuals. I'm actually...hehe...not going completely one way myself. Either way I feel for you; there's not much difference between homophobia and stupidity nowdays. |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Anya (-)
on Jun 09, 2002 - 03:51 PM
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I guess people are just stupid (like that's new, haha). Nothing is wrong with sexual preference. Not like a guy having a gay friend means his gay friend is going to attack him. Sheesh.
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by IamSquid (AAA@sockmonkeys.net)
on Jun 09, 2002 - 10:33 PM
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Gotta agree with Zander.
WHAT COULD BE MORE GAY THAN HOMOPHOBIA!?!?!
That's right, ever notice how all those guys talking about "fags" in highschool were hardcore into homoerotic sports and showing-off their muscles to other guys?
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Xaoswolf (Xaoswolf@hotmail.com) on Jun 10, 2002 - 07:12 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://Xaoswolf.tripod.com | | I always liked when they said things about what we wore on the swim team. Of course we got to watch the female swimmers do their stretchs, they just got to watch each other. |
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Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any
by IamSquid (AAA@sockmonkeys.net) on Jun 11, 2002 - 01:28 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | | Goddman right! If it wasn't for lifegaurding class not only would I probably have never shaved my body but it's the only way my lips ever had a shot at being pressed against those of the most attractive lesbian the gods ever graced our planet with. |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference
by Xaoswolf (Xaoswolf@hotmail.com) on Jun 12, 2002 - 11:20 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://Xaoswolf.tripod.com | Ah yes, lifeguarding, the only way for adolescent boys to actually get to be that close to wet teen lesbians.
<sniff> Oh how I miss those days... |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Comedian (eccentrically_long@yahoo.com)
on Jun 10, 2002 - 12:41 AM
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I bet if he met a lesbian he'd ask if he could bring his camera.
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jun 10, 2002 - 12:51 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/strangeasangels/ | I bet if he met a true blue butch, he WOULDN'T ask, he'd wet himself. And if he still had the balls to ask, she'd knock him flat.
I'd pay to see that. |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Xaoswolf (Xaoswolf@hotmail.com)
on Jun 10, 2002 - 08:51 AM
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Ever think of genetics as the reason for why guys would want two girls, and not another a girl and a guy in bed with him. Look at it this way, two girls means he can spread his seed twice as much, and create more children to propogate his line, but if there is another male there, then there is a chance that someone else will get the woman pregnant. Look at lions, one dude gets all of the pride, and if another male comes close, they fight it out. Does that make the lions homophobic, I wouldn't think so.
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Shade (Shade@Gothcult.com) on Jun 10, 2002 - 11:24 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.hotelshade.com | Technically speaking, there is in fact a very good genetic reason for one guy to want multiple female sex partners. A guy can actually get it up and come again within minutes in the presence of a second female because her smell is different. It's all about propogation of the seed. I don't know if that extends to gay guys with multiple men but it;s possible, the spreading of seed thing wouldn't still hold true, but the smells would be different so it would make sense.
I can actually speak from experience and say that two guys on one girl also has a similar effect though in tha each male has a subconscious competition thing going on so they can occassionaly get it up and going again very quickly in the presence of the other male 'mating' with the female. humourously enough, this does nothing for the propogation of the species as two men coming in close succession would just kill off each others sperm. That's one of the reasons why hookers aren't surrounded by children...
Well, that was a bit of a ramble. |
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Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 10, 2002 - 07:20 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | That explains quite a lot, I thought it was just me. Thanks for the perspective man, I just thought I was lame at sex unless there were several people around. Incidentally, I don't really get the competition thing but the multiple females thing with the smells sounds like exactly what goes on in my experience. I bow to your observational skills, and I shall sacrifice a Rodent Of Unusual Size in your name. |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference
by Schizo on Jun 11, 2002 - 12:19 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | An R.O.U.S.???!!! Don't tell me you're a Princess Bride fan too? God, I've watched that thing so many times... had a HUGE crush on Inigo Montoya! (you keeled my father - prepare to die!) |
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a differe
by Rogue (Rogue@skew.org) on Jun 12, 2002 - 08:20 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | I wanted to be the Dread Pirate Robert when I grew up, whenever that happens. It was funny for me to watch that because I knew Mandy from his music and from Alien Nation (Sam Francisco) so it was odd to see him with an accent. Come on, Princess Bride is like bisexuality, you either admit to liking it or you are lying.
Didja notice that the six fingered man only has six finger on one hand, for a total of 11? Chris Guest was in Spinal Tap as well, and had the amp that went to 11....
Let me splain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up. |
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com) on Jun 10, 2002 - 11:50 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.obolisk.com | Yes, but humans with our excessively large brains, can surpass most preprogrammed urges. Only if we understand them, and USE OUR BRAINS. Always I see people living out their lives in the way that allows them to use their brains as little as possible. Instead of two males fighting it out because their instinct tells them to, why don't they talk or make each other happy for that matter.
We are not lions. Humans, by nature, are bisexual. So the use of social stereotypes is unrealistic. Colin is just acting out a common American male gender role- homophobic, sex crazed but afraid of women usually, aggressive, insensitive (no crying allowed!), spastic, destructive, and stupid. He has become his own stereotype. He is probably not unique at all because his entire character and personality is probably based on that gender role. But he does not realize that all of that is unnecessary. All of this makes him a smaller person because he probably hasn't put any thought towards anything other than the social canned answer. This situation is typical of American males, who are actually programmed to think this way from toddler hood, on.
Lions have strength. Humans have intelligence. People can surpass many aspects of human ignorance and stupidity just by thinking (ironically). It's that easy.
(but that probably doesn't make sense because lions sleep 20 hours a day. Makes me wonder how much humans actually use their brains? perhaps a few minutes a day?)
Also that is true, males who want two women want to reproduce, by instinct, times two. However, how many modern males today want to get a bunch of random women pregnant? Males do not in reality want to reproduce with two women. They just want sex, which is different to the human animal than reproduction, hence why it is irrelevant weather you have sex with a male or a female: reproduction is not a factor. This is the beginning of an important thought process, but is usually ignored passed the condom. |
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by firefly7 (-) on Jun 12, 2002 - 03:23 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Hello? Not about having kids here... it's about sex, pure and simple. Do guys ussually want to watch another guy? No. Do guys ussually want to see two girls? Yes. Mind you I say ussually... but still... Come on now? |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by firefly7 (-)
on Jun 10, 2002 - 12:56 PM
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Thank you to every one that replyed. Colin is reading it now and wants me to mention that he was just "speaking his mind". But w/e. Anywho- thanks again!
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com)
on Jun 10, 2002 - 08:21 PM
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The Bibble (yes, I mean Bibble not Bible) quote in question is from my favorite book in the Bibble. Leviticus!!!
The quote word for word according to the Jerusalem Bibble goes as follows-
Leviticus 20:21 Line 13- "The man who lies with a man in the same way as with a woman: they have done a hateful thing together; they must die; their blood shall be on their own their own heads."
Keep in mind Leviticus says nothing about lesbian sex directly, so it can be assumed that big mac daddy Yahweh likes when two hunnies get in on. So lesbianism may be assumed as not sinful. (One point for team dyke)
But keep in mind the bible says many other things as well. One of my favorite quotes is from Psalm.
Psalm 137:24 Line 8- "O Daughter of Babylon, doomed to destruction, blessed by God is he who repays you for what you have done to us; a blessing on him who seizes your infants and dashes their brains against the rocks."
Yes that’s right, kill innocent babies for god. He obviously wants you too. (One point for Planned Parenthood)
This will probably upset a few people...
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by nocta on Jun 12, 2002 - 10:12 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Bibble, that's one I haven't heard before. I know someone that calls it the Babble. :) |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by nocta on Jun 12, 2002 - 10:20 PM
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Someone once told me that nowhere in the Bible does it specifically say you cannot be a homosexual. There are bits that can be interpreted (some might say twisted) into saying that, but there's no Thou Shalt Not Be A Homo law or anything. If you know of a passage that says this straight (no pun intended) out, please let me know, and also include which version you are reading. I do tend to think that a lot of people use the Bible as an excuse for their homophobia.
Besides, I've been told many times that God created each person specially...if being gay was wrong, then why would He create some people that way? Why can't people just Love Thy Neighbor...or at least butt out of their business?
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com) on Jun 13, 2002 - 05:17 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.obolisk.com | Actually my quote is as good as it gets. You will find a lot of that crap in Leviticus (Wearing cotton/polyester blends is a sin so severe you should stone those who commit it.. he he he :D). But keep in mind every Bibble has been translated several times and has been edited by popes, scholars etc. so the "Word of god" is a bit flawed. You can dismiss anything said in the Bibble because it is not in its original ancient text. For example, when one translates Spanish into English, the female/male forms of words are lost; or in Japanese there are several words for "love" as opposed to one word in English. When that word is translated, it loses those ambiguous meanings that the other words accounted for.
But the Bibble says nothing much directly: the only direct thing are the commandments. All sins are usually linked to stories or passages in the Bibble and are not direct at all.
Keep in mind that the commandments are more important than any of those passages and stories. So "Love thy neighbor" is more straight forward than "The man who lies with a man in the same way as with a woman: they have done a hateful thing together; they must die". (As I stated it only discusses male/male homosexuality directly, not female/female. Also t doesn't say intercourse, which in other parts of Leviticus it does. It can be interpreted as treating a man like a woman, so transvestitism is a sin rather.)
Also keep in mind that the ancient text it came from probably didn't have a term for homosexual. That may be hard to believe English has the most words over any other language in the world. So sometimes many words are used to describe one term. (Example: "Bastard" means "fatherless child" but one term is used to display this. You may not have such a word in Navajo, for example, they would say fatherless child as opposed to “bastard“).
Next as far as god making everyone specifically for some purpose, who knows. God according to the Bibble is very vague on why he does things, so it's all up in the air; no one is completely right on that subject. But the commandments are clear, and those are supposed to followed first and foremost. so anyone who ignores them to blow out of proportion a single line in Leviticus is probably committing a larger sin than the person or people they are brandishing their righteous fingers at.
Now remember what I say about this... The Bibble is not in its original context. It has been rewritten, mistranslated, and edited by popes, scholars, kings, monks of the middle ages, and other insipid peoples. Unless you have something like the dead sea scrolls written by the apostles themselves, and you have the ability to read ancient Judaic cuneiform, it is not the "true" clear word of god. It is only the worlds longest and most vain game of "telephone" ever, The modern Holy Bibble. |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any
by Skarphedin on Jun 18, 2002 - 04:02 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | I highly recommend Asimov's Guide to the Bible as an interesting read. You wouldn't believe the things people got wrong as the bible was reinterpreted and retranslated and edited over the centuries. |
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Re: Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any
by callei (plyn@plynlymon.com) on Jun 28, 2002 - 01:51 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.plynlymon.com | one other point is that Jeusus said something to the effect that " i am the new covenant with man, all that has gone before is over. my word is now your law. Love is the new law"
so all the "commandments" are null and void by his word. |
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Re: Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more
by firefly7 (-) on Jun 13, 2002 - 04:04 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | | I totally agree that people use the Bible as an excuse for homophobia, I know at least 5 people that do. But as my dad says "The Bible is man's word, not God's." Not that I'm saying if this suposed "God" said it it would be okay but... I think the point is understood. |
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Re: Homophobics and stupid people in my life, is there even a difference any more?
by sorceress_ly (darknessembraced_andariel@yahoo.com)
on Jun 28, 2002 - 10:04 AM
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I understand. As a bi girl I get a lot of shit and nice comments about it. Girls usually hate it but guys love it. I have many gay friends and have had many bi lovers its just diffrent when it comes to guys. I dont mind having a thing with a guy who is by but when it comes to dating I can't. I don't like to share my boyfreinds at all, but that's just me. I need some chocolate too...it fixes everything.
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