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| Articles: Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire |
Posted by
Dolorosa on Monday, December 10, 2001 - 09:56 AM PST
Alright, I'm new around here, and mostly I just like to be a creep and listen... but I figured you all might like to hear this, so it's time for a little bravery. I work for the US Navy, which means I probably don't resemble your average Goth (if ever there was an average Goth)... it's difficult to be a bizarre little shard of darkness in the middle of a military regime...
Anyway, rambling again... Until recently I was stationed in Okinawa, Japan... but right now I'm a little further out. About half an hour ago or so... I was blessed and cursed with a vision. Nihilism and dark emotional affinities aside, when you witness the sudden and complete obliteration of a little over three hundred people in one bright, oddly beautiful tower of fire... things start coming into question.
This isn't one of those stupid little prophetic visions, nah... this was a daisy cutter erupting over a little town whos name I can't recall, wouldn't say if I could, and doesn't really matter anymore anyhow.
Questions started popping into my head...are we doing the right thing? I mean sure, they blew up our towers, killed a whole bunch of innocents... yaddah-yaddah. But in all honesty, I didn't think these people even had the slightest clue what was going on. I saw a freaking kid wave at our ship right before the blast.
Suddenly inhumanity blurs my perceptions of right and wrong... my typically darksome mindset is kind of flashed out right now.Who the fuck are we? I'd be grateful for any help to piece together my head...patriotism not withstanding... I'd really rather have a nice cup of tea and maybe listen to some music that makes my mother question my ethics, than ever, ever see something like that ever again...
As a side note... have you any idea how difficult it is to get decent eyeshadow on a ship? On the upside... I've managed to actually acquire some old kamphor paste...very fun stuff.
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| Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire | Login/Create an account | 38 Comments |
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Re: Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire
by feralucce on Dec 10, 2001 - 07:32 PM
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I can only say... Isn't shelling innocents... like "they" did... isn't that terrorism as well... we... are a danger to the world... and we are issuing in a new age of horror for the entire world...
feral
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- WTF?!! by Rae on Dec 11, 2001 - 01:52 AM
- Re: WTF?!! by feralucce on Dec 11, 2001 - 10:41 AM
Re: Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com)
on Dec 10, 2001 - 08:59 PM
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hmm...I heard that they dropped a daisy cutter in a mountain range in afghanistan where bin laden was suposedly holed up.
It's not something you should ever want to see...it's horrible, terifying, and after seeing on TV or in person the horrors of last september, it's something that I think we all can relate to.
There is no right or wrong in war. Never is. And as much as it sucks, though most never expect it to happen, it's what you take the chance in participating or at least viewing the horrors of war on BOTH sides of the fence when you join the military.
As much as I hate the whole situation, hate that more people are going to die, and at risk of sounding childish, they (not the afghani's) took the first swing, and now it's time to take the bully down hard, or things like the trade center destruction will happen again and again all over the world. In the military you have to think of things in numbers, in cost of lives if necessary, and of your own people. If we had ignored the terrorist attack, an attack heralding freaking WAR, if there was ever so blatant a message, then it would be the same over and over and over and people would be crying "what are you doing about this? What about us?" So you do something about it, and people cry "what are you doing? What about them?"
There is no right answer. Honestly I would rather be seen as brutal and vengeful after a hit like that, than weak and watery and open for another kick to the jewels.
War always costs more than money, it costs lives....and sometimes those lives lost can save a whole lot of other people in the future.
Our soldiers died in WWII so that their families and children and grandchildren could grow up free. Yes, they died, yes, it's tragic, but it's war. There is no up or down, there is no right or wrong, and it's not supposed to be fun and it's not supposed to make you feel good, and when it's happening you cannot avoid it, and you're not supposed to like it, but it has to be done. Has to, not only for our sake, but for theirs. Lives were lost so they could play soccer without a public execution interruption, so they could APPLAUD (which was illegal) instead of sitting still and calling "praise allah" to show their approval, so women could show their face for the first time in YEARS, so a man could shave his beard or reopen his record store that was deemed illegal by his government, so he could play in the street to groups of people that hadn't heard music in what seemed like forever. Each and every one of those lives would have been ended either literally or physically if we or someone chose to do nothing. If you were a woman, you had nothing to lose anyways....and most would give their lives if they thought it would bring freedom and a chance at a real life, education, a future to their daughters.
I don't think that by wiping out one psycho cave man we're going to end terrorism worldwide and we'll live in this fabulous eutopia. But if anything I'd hope it'd send an example to those who wish to try it again...and let them learn by example that they were fucking with the wrong people.
I'm sorry you had to see a thing so terrible.
Maybe from her story we can finally understand why vietnam/ww1/ww2/korea vets were so fucked up when they got home...because they not only saw that, they've looked men and children in they eyes before death. America hasn't been in a "real" war for ages...we've had military actions, peace keeping actions, etc. and maybe this time we've had it, and are ready to say "you know what? Enough's enough. Game over."
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Re: Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire
by callei (plyn@plynlymon.com)
on Dec 11, 2001 - 11:52 PM
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Im embarassed by this fight. I see a few people throwing propaganda (yes this is ALL propaganda) backa nd forth as though it were actual "reasons" for what is going on.
The REASON that we get bombed by middle eastern countries is that it makes sense to them to do it. the reason that we bombthem back is that it makes sense to us to do it.
It would be marvelous if we could invade Some country that doenst like us with Food, education, healthcare, and hope instead of bombs. but that would (believe it or not) be too expensive. It would take a shorter amount of time, but would cost way more.
Can you imagine the response? We show up with thousands of tons of food so that every child gets a real meal everyday. we show up with enough medicine so that the infant death rate drops by 200% and so that women dont die from afterbirth infections. We show up with books that teach people to read and to do algebra. We show uo with paint and clay and crayons so that people can express their hearts. we give it all for free to all that ask.
How long could they (meaning the average starving woman with 2 kids) hate us? How long could the soldiers hate with their families supported by us? Honnor means alot in some cultures.
The part of all of this that i take the most offense to is that it took such a big death tool before we were ready to try to deal with terrorism in the US. We have had "our" people killed and kidnapped all ove rthe world. we have lost thousands to it already. but we only care enough to get pissed when they blow up something on our soil.
So its really "terrorism" when they blow up people en mass (instead of mass murder) and not when they blow them up a few ata time? that bugs me.
And how do we fight a war on "terrorism" ? who do we kill to make it end?
Mostly do we really have the resourses to fight a three front war: Drugs, crime and terrorism? (none of which have been decalred wars by the legal vote of congress, just declared illegally by presidents)
I dont want any more americans to die, be tramatized, or miss thier families. I dont want to see the faces of the children left behind when thier mother shields them with her body and dies and they live and try to wake her up.
War isnt pretty or fun, but it is cheaper than the alternative.
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Re: Oddly Beautiful Tower of Fire
by whitedove (jaroddove@doveworksentertainment.com)
on Dec 12, 2001 - 10:19 AM
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Have you ever wondered why we have war at all? There are 2 primitive reasons species kill other species or members of their own species: 1st one being to destroy a threat; preditor kills preditor for lack of competition. The 2nd one is preditor kills weak to cause a species to evolve.
Now, do I believe in Evolution? Yes, in fact - evolution is something that is undeniable. Do I believe we evolved from a fish or monkey? No, that isn't logical at all. What evolution is is the addaptation a species makes due to change in climate, terrain, society, resources, and eradication of weakness. For some species to actually evolve and get stronger it will kill off its sick or diseased kin - so they don't breed the weakness in. Other species however (humans for example) will breed weakness in, making the species weaker. Now, what does this have to do with the topic? I'll fill you in:
We have had war forever, since the beginning of written history: Why? It is to destroy a weaker or stronger force so that there is no competition. Right now, we are trying to destroy the threat of terrorism - to do that we feel (just like any war in history) that we must destroy our opponents. Does this justify killing innocent people? Of course it doesn't - or in the same respect what happened on 9-11 was justifiable.
Now, to actually try to answer your question - We are just a society - formed and built off of societies of the past. I would much rather sit down, talk with someone who is different than I, share my opinion and hope that I leave the conversation more enlightened than when I entered it. But, humans are primitive, just like other species - we are blood thirsty, we are barbaric, and we are constantly afraid. This whole war doesn't end with Bin Laden - it won't end with terrorism - it will keep going until someone is on top. No country stands equal to another - it is a race for complete domination.
Now, as for right and wrong - what is right? Is it what we are told? Things are drilled into our heads a certain way from day one (public schooling and government standards). I remember learning that Christopher Columbus was this great man who discovered America so that we could all live here - he also discovered the world was round too. As I got older it turned out that Columbus really didn't 'discover' America, and many cultures already knew the world was round. Much later I learned that Columbus actually killed many native Americans at site, and captured many others as slaves. The only complement he had in his memoirs was to the effect of "These are a great and strong people, they are at one with the land and seemed determined in their work, (then it becomes an insult) they will make excellent slaves." (forgive my wording, I don't have the information right in front of me, just polling from memory). Why were we once taught that Columbus was great? So we will try to acheive great things? I don't think it is, I think it actually goes to us being developed and manipulated to what they want. Who complains to have the history books updated to contain correct information? No one, because it better suits the government if people believe history that sounds good rather than history that is true. I even remember some of my teachers would deny that we had intern camps for Japanese here in America. The definition of right is defined by you - it is something we all know. When ever you do something that makes you questions whether it is right or wrong, you are doing one extreme that is told to be the other. Telling someone to kill a whole village to get one person is a terrible act - but the government will justify it by saying, "It had to be done." And as much as it is wrong and I hate to say it - according to the type of society humans have built; it does need done. We crave tragedy and violence; so just as much as we condemn them, we create them.
(Sorry about rambling there, Dolorosa - if you email me I will clarify for you wh
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