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Articles: Death becomes them... |
Posted by
bettie_x on Tuesday, December 04, 2001 - 12:02 PM PST
I watch a lot of history channel programs. Too many, if you ask people who know me, my favorite being "serial killer 4th of july" every year (which I missed this year *sniff*).
And as we in the washington area know, (or you should...what, do you live in a bubble or something?) that after how many decades and 49 victims (some bodies sill missing and not included in the total death count), they've caught the green river killer.
The question I pose:
What do we do with him.
Everyone knows that these people are bad. Granted, they don't really deserve to waste our air. But who's say is it who dies and who doesn't? Killers from decades past, their files reopened, new technology applied to long dead victims exonorates the long ago executed believed murderer. Now what.
Can you imagine, on death row, led to the execution room, the poison enters your blood, you die with the knowledge your family will carry a false shame, that you will die and the killer is out there, and knowing that so many of the victim's family and friends are there to watch an innocent person die at the hands of the government.
Imagine: your daughter, wife, sister, husband, son is murdered. They catch the killer. You fight tooth and nail to have the bastard euthanized. You succeed. You witness his execution. 10 years....1year! The reopen the case, find the now dead man innocent, and you unwittingly aided the murder of a wrongly convicted man, the real murderer still at large, safe behind the veil of the final execution of the "murderer". Such murderers as the Zodiac Killer. For a while the Unibomber. For a while the Green River Killer. Now known to still be at large, the Boston Strangler.
Right wing conservatives and bleeding heart human rights activists pass laws that make it illegal for a terminally ill patient to end their own suffering in a manner which they choose, instead of lingering and shuffling towards a certain end. The laws passed, yet the government executes criminals based on circumstantial evidence, foggy "eye witness" testimony, and something as simple as no alibi because you took a ride in your car at the time of the murder to a mcdonald's down the road instead of hanging out with a friend "just in case".
The man accused of being the boston strangler was executed. I see on the television today that new DNA evidence has exonorated him.
People convicted in a murder of one person get the juice, when someone convicted of a series of murders spends life in prison without parol.
What are the difining lines? How can one murder deserve the death penelty versus several murders that recieve just a life penalty in prison?
I recently ran across a database list of death row last meal requests (don't ask). Is a man who requests his last meal be donated to a homeless person a murderer? Someone who's last meal request is justice, peace, and salvation? Yes, killers lie, but they're going to die anyway, so what would be the point of prolonging the facade of innocence?
The point is, with something as final as death, shouldn't there be more to the decision that circumstantial evidence or heresay? Or emotionally charged "evidence" by traumatized victims or witnesses?
I also distinctly remember a case where a woman positively I.D.ed a man who had raped her. DNA evidence later found it to be another man who had done the deed, but emotional trauma, hounding by police, and preassure to find the assailant by law officials had made her believe that the man she I.D.ed was in fact her rapist. He spent 10 yrs in jail. He missed the birth of his first child.
Humans are emotional creatures if nothing else. It is impossible to make an unemotional decision based on such things as murder, rape, and violent crime. Our emotions govern our day to day activities, our lives, our thinking, our rationalization, what we do, what we say and to whom....
Are such emotional and often unbalanced by trauma, love, and other such emotions (like why an abused spouse tolerates the abuse, justifies the abuse, and insists that the abuser "loves them and doesn't mean to hit so hard") capable of making a literal life and death situation?
I will consent that there are some people that do need to be "removed"....unless there is no cold hard evidence or smoking gun in hand. Timothy McVey....he admited to it. Jeffery Dahmer was found with several bodies in various states of eaten in his apartment, one in ice in the tub, Jeffy admitting to taking cold showers over it so as not to melt the ice. We didn't have to take care of that....the prison's tennants took care of him for us.
It's late, and this is all for now. The question is posed: What deserves the death penelty Who deserves the death penelty Is the death penelty worth the risk Should the death penelty be rid of As emotional beings, are we capable of competently deciding who dies and who doesn't
I'm curious.
As for me, I feel it needs to be done away with, or deserving of only the most horrible crimes imaginable and a rare and most severe punnishment to be dealt out sparingly.
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Death becomes them... | Login/Create an account | 9 Comments |
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Re: Death becomes them...
by chameleon on Dec 04, 2001 - 03:25 PM
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If somebody wishes to die, and is sick or old, we should not disallow their wishes. That is deprivation of the soul in my opinion. I also think we should abolish the death penaly, and give life sentences without parole. Then, they can ask to be euthanized, and if the case is reopened and a new killer found, we can let the old suspect go, if he wants, of course...
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Re: Death becomes them... by Ironboots on Dec 04, 2001 - 03:47 PM (User info | Send a Message) http://ranger.vr9.com/Flash.html | I agree, because a guilty man will have a lot less hope for getting free than an innocent man, and thus the innocent man wouldn't ask for the axe/rope/juice/whathaveyou, while the guilty man might... Since civilization began we've had the death penalty, and it hasn't worked... Don't you think we should try something new? |
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Re: Death becomes them...
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com)
on Dec 05, 2001 - 01:05 AM
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Good comments, both of you.
I am not for the death penelty.
I also hate the fact that these buttholes are living on my tax dollars. The solution?
Make the jackasses WORK!
Things that we would usually pay for people to do, like road work, civil services, trash collection, etc.
I like the idea of letting them opt for death. The thing that bugs me is "suicide watch".
Watch them? Watch them do what everyone wants to happen to them! What they deserve.
And as for the prison system....UGH.
Free fucking cable television? Top line weight rooms? ROOM SERVICE?!
In MY oh so humble opinion, if you legalize drugs like pot and such and prostitution, you cut the prison population in half, cut the crime rate in half (people won't be killing over drugs if you can get pot at the 7-11)
Then, you can focus on the real fuckwits and fuckups of society...the militia murderers, the rapists, the child molesters, cocksucking lawyers etc.
You get a bed, a toilet, and instant mashed potatoes. Hell, make them grow their own food. Your exercise is running around the mudhole regardless of weather.
You aren't a tennant of a luxury resort. You are a motherfucking criminal. Treat them like they are. Don't like it? Well, you shouldn't have laid your filthy paws on an unsuspecting 6yr old neighbor girl who had a crush on her older teenage guy next door with a sack of shit for a brain. Shouldn't have taken advantage of her parent's trust. It's your fault, if any time, it's now to be a goddamned man and pay for being a white trash fuckup.
Prison should be as fun as being a victim is.
Death sentence? No....making the same life/death choice for someone makes us no better than they who made that same choice for their helpless victim.
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Re: Death becomes them...
by callei (plyn@plynlymon.com)
on Dec 05, 2001 - 02:33 AM
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Ok, yes killing people is sometimes wrong. But innocent people die, everyday all over the place. Isnt death part of what makes us human? Choosing life for ourselves and the animals around us and for our children is part of the price we pay for intelligence. Yes we do kill innocent people, both with our government and with our states, and with our counties, and with our towns.
On a very cruel note, the world is over populated and, although i would rather not die just yet, some of have to to make room for the babies that are being born.
Yes get rid of silly crimes. dont protect us from ourselves so much because it just hurts us even more.
But killing violent criminals? many of them get to live just so that we can study them, analize them, mentally disect them. Wouldnt it be kinder to kill them? But lets be sorry that they die, not revel in thier deaths. Lets thank them for dying to make room for the next baby.
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Re: Death becomes them... by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Dec 07, 2001 - 12:50 AM (User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/strangeasangels/ | yes, "innocent" people die every day...but a "structured" execution? That sort of "punnishment" is the result of an egalitarian and sophisticated society? Not in my opinion..
Let them OPT for death....
and like I said...imagine being executed for a crime you didn't commit. The accused boston strangler was redeemed YEARS after his arrest and trial....imagine if we had executed him.
This fair and egalitarian and human rights oriented society would have given "swift and severe justice" to an innocent man. Sucks.
We can never be too sure for such an important decision as life or death.
As for overpopulation, I can't agree more! Ever heard of birth control? Jeezus! Something tells me that if you cut benifits for single mothers it would drop dramatically. Less girls saying "oops, out of condoms...oh well, there's always welfare."
NOT to say that all single mothers are cruising for a free ride...not at all. My best friend is going to be a single mother in april (not sure though, he wants to get married, but she's being very cautious so as not to get screwed further)
Hell, we'd all feel differently probably if in those situations and not sitting in comfy homes eating warm mashed potatoes at midnight typing over the affairs of our sad sad world on our computers :)
Pass no judgement, but I'll be damned if they'll take away my opinions ! :) |
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Re: Death becomes them... by callei (plyn@plynlymon.com) on Dec 07, 2001 - 11:43 AM (User info | Send a Message) http://www.plynlymon.com | ok i just gotta say that single moms make up less than half of welfare recipiants. And they only get to be on welfare for 2 years now. Then they have to get a job. yes even if they are 17 and thier child has "special needs"(deformity, illness, brain damage).
And they are less likely than non welfare single mom to have a second kid. Uf they get pregnant again, they dont get a full 2 years for the next baby, they only get like a 6 month extention until they have to get a job.
Single moms are WORTHY of all the help we can give them. They are raising the people that will pay the taxes to support us when we are old. They are at least as worthy as our vetrans, elderly, and disabled to have our help.
just had to include that. Single moms have enough problems without being labeled as socila leaches. They are already treated as badly enough.
And innocent people are offed everyday systematically by gangs, doctors making executive choices, thier families, etc.
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Re: Death becomes them... by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Dec 11, 2001 - 09:03 PM (User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/strangeasangels/ | Oh, I'm not doubting that single mothers need all the help they can get, not at all, and they're NOT all social leeches....
I guess just in the area that I"ve grown up, and talking to the girls that my fiance works with, all I hear is "my baby's daddy" and how they can't wait for the welfare checks...not to mention they all drive decent cars, have cell phones, money to smoke and drink lattes, but can't feed their children without the government....and most of them have no intention of going off welfare anytime soon.
I've also not heard of the limit....that's what I get for not registering to vote, don't pay attention to local voter issues...I"m such a slacker.
And yes, innocent people are offed everyday.....
but execution? Along with just the death, the family members (I believe, could be wrong as I have been before when there's not a lot of free time to gather facts) don't get any of the executed's benifits, not to mention defamation of name and character. At least when someone is murdered, it's sudden and there is no question about it...but can you imagine the utter sense of failure when you have to FIGHT day and night to prove your (enter relation here)'s innocence, only to have them executed and then later redeemed when dead? I mean, can you imagine having the last name of dahmer? Gacy? Gein? Manson?
say these men were innocent (yeah right) but just for devil's advocate reasons....and you were tagged with the name of a "murderer" for years, and we all know even if the name is cleared, you still have that baggage, that shame of being so-and-so-that awful man's mother, sister, father, brother, WIFE or child? It's horrible!
Perhaps if we spent more time letting natural selection take it's course, we wouldn't be so over run with bodies.....but on the other hand, at the hands of wonderful medical advances, we're curing SYMPTOMS of genetic diseases, allowing them to continue in the human lineage, and one day we'll literally breed ourselves into extinction, unless they can alter the faulty dna, and even then who knows what catastrophe lies beyond that.... |
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Ohhh, eech.
by Comedian (comedian@callatg.com)
on Dec 05, 2001 - 06:39 AM
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Only problem with making them work is the fact that you give shitty labor, you get shitty results. Prisoners have no motivation, they're just outside basking in the free world again soaking up a tan.
And you still see "adopt a highway" programs. And if you just slam everybody with life without parole, hell, I'd go knock some kid down the street, cause that's cheap, easy living. Let tha taxpayers pay for you to be around, lifting weights, raping petty criminals when they first come in, all that sort of fun.
I say, dismember the arm they killed the person with. 1. Horrible mark on them or committing a crime against society, 2. you'll be damn sure they'll never kill again, because it's simple enough to learn to write with the other hand, but damn, if you lose both, you're SOL.
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Re: Ohhh, eech. by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Dec 07, 2001 - 12:52 AM (User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/strangeasangels/ | If they made prisons less of an easy street and more of the penetentiaries they profess to be, then it wouldn't be such a desireable place to land your ass. Less of such a urge to free your life of expenses by plowing over a kid! |
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