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Author: Subject: "Jews are going to Hell!"

Extreme Fanatic





Posts: 656
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 12/4/2003 at 11:15 AM
Am I a "fanatical Christian"? No. I was agnostic not so long ago, but I do believe in a creator and consider Christ a bodhistava (spelling?) for a far and wide term. However, I'm not religious - I'm spiritual (there's a big difference, in fact without spirituality there'd be no religion in general). But for whatever reason, a handful of suppose "Christians" believe that Jews are going to go to Hell for not believing in Christ being the Son of the One Above. This is somewhat amusing...yet somewhat annoying at the same time (should guess how much it's been brought up to annoy me). Probably a redundant topic to bring up, but when did so... "compassionate" people start condemning others just for not going fanatically with their beliefs?

I think Christ taught more of compassion - not this hate and strong and out judgement of other people. Either way, I would like to style this more philosophical than religious...if people do not mind:

What is wrong with this picture?

I'm far from religious, as I said. In fact, I do not care if anyone lacks spirituality or not...but for the sake of a philosophical discussion over this and the folklore around it.

 

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Fanatic




Posts: 499
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 8/5/2004 at 03:43 AM
At last, an interesting topic. I'm pretty sure the Jewish people are doomed to damnation. But hey, that just me.

BB.

Abbadon

 

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Light is changing to shadow, and casting a shroud over all we have known.

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 759
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  posted on 7/5/2004 at 08:59 PM
z24qbcd1, its nice of you to have taken the time and effort to tell us about the Jewish View on that "jesus is a jew" nonsense that so many of the less educated (in thier own history and faith) have. for the record, he was also a bad roman. I really appriciate that. to the best of my knowledge we have three people that follow the jewish faith here.

i doubt you will be back to check on this, but i am going to say it anyways. Most of the people in the world, including those that are already dead and those that havent been born yet, have never heard of your god. they dont care about your (and i use "your" to mean all the semi-hemi-demi- monothesits out there) god. They try to be nice to you because you are so impoverished in things to believe in and love.

 

____________________
Real goths wear silver and crosses to keep the werewolves and vampires away.

 

Coward




Posts: 1
Registered: 7/5/2004
Status: Offline

  posted on 7/5/2004 at 02:47 PM
I had to respond to this thread. I am a relgious Jew (Jew by choice for religous reasons, I converted two years ago) and many only know that Judaism discounts Jesus with any divinty and thats all they know.

First of all, I (and most other Jews) resent the fact that people associate Jesus as a Jew. He wasn't. Christians feel he was a Jew. Jews view him (for the most part) as a rebel, going against the laws G-d gave Moses in the Torah. (The first five books of the Bible). If you want to "tag" him as a Jew, then he's a TERRIBLE Jew. Enough said about that.

Hell, what is this place? The Hebrew Scriptures (Old Testament) mention nothing about a firely place where G-d's advisory reigns. Isn't G-d powerful enough to destroy his enemies? The entire Hell, Satan (Satan as G-d's enemy) is rubbish in the eyes of Judaism. If anything, Judaism associates Satan as G-d's cheif prosecutor who sometimes is over-eager to get convictions.

Also, the Ten Commandments and most other commandments in the Hebrew Scriptures only apply to the Children of Israel. Notice the preamble of the Ten Commandments (By many which is part of the First Commandment). G-d reminds that He lead the Children of Israel out of slavery and there shall be no other gods but Him. The laws that apply to non-Jews are best shown at a very nice web site: www.asknoah.org. I suggest you check it out!

Finally and most importantly, we are all created in His image. Not just Jews, or Christians or Muslims, but ALL people. The Talmud states it beautifully. It was asked why did G-d created man with only one person orgianlly, that person being Adam? The sages state it was because no one could ever say that their bloodline was better than anothers.

Shalom.

 

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Fanatic




Posts: 459
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  posted on 8/3/2004 at 01:29 PM
We heathens gotta stick together you know.

 

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"It is a fool's prerogative to utter truths that no one else will speak." ~ The Sandman, Dream Country

 

Extreme Fanatic




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  posted on 8/3/2004 at 03:16 AM
I know what you're talking about, Zero. I can't think of the particular passage you mentioned, but one I've always loved (in the King James Version- you may not agree with the accuracy of the translation, but damn the language is beautiful!)

It states that Jesus was "a gluttoneous man and a wine-bibber, a friend of publicans and sinners". Awesome.

 

____________________
"You can tell by the scars on my arms and the cracks in my hips and the dents in my car and the blisters on my lips that I'm not the carefullest of girls." - Dresden Dolls, "Girl Anachronism"

 

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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 10:24 PM
smurfs, any zoamorphic animals, and he man

 

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Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Fanatic




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Registered: 15/2/2004
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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 09:36 PM
I find that very interesting....you know....that you can actually pick up a Bible and read it every so often...I wish I had the motivation to learn more about the different religions out there.

Not many christians would do that, take a look at other religions, Many of us just beleive what we're handed and others of us don't care all too much...to be honest I don't really care all too much about religion.....I do hate when people take it too far and start telling me that Harry Potter is Evil.

Oh yeah true story......Someone once told me (when I was a kid) the Smurphs were devil worship (the person wasn't a kid). I couldn't watch the Smurphs for a while after that....not until I wised up a bit.

 

____________________
"It is a fool's prerogative to utter truths that no one else will speak." ~
The Sandman, Dream Country

 

Extreme Fanatic




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Registered: 31/12/1969
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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 09:19 PM
No, you haven't offended me at all Zero. I agree with you. I have respect for Christians who follow Jesus' teachings and are not fanatical. In fact, I sometimes still skim through the Bible for the heck of it and I'm not even Christian.


 

Fanatic




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Registered: 15/2/2004
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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 08:29 PM
I think that people tend to forget that there have been some good things that come from chritianity....even though there're asses out there that use the bible as weapon....It's not the fault of the bible it's the fault human comprehension. I always thought that the bible was more of a guide that sometimes you could look to for advice....I do admit that in it are a lot wrath and vengence, but maybe that's put there for us to look at and say "hey, that's wrong...killing in the name of god is wrong". More than likley the answers to lifes problems aren't all found in the bible....in fact did you know that Jesus favored the "worldly" more then the church folk....(there is an actual passage in the bible that says so. I know it sounds weird but there is, i just cant remember it.....learned it from Bible study).....something about being more knowledgeable or whatever. I think that mainly most religions are pure and innocent. But then people aren't perfect and can't think beyond themselves sometimes and use religion for their own benefit.

(sorry if I came off as preachy or if i was being offensive)

 

____________________
"It is a fool's prerogative to utter truths that no one else will speak."
~

The Sandman, Dream Country

 

Extreme Fanatic




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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 01:18 PM
that's the thing... if they allow one, they must allow the other... and... the rest... rarely wanna make waves

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.



Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Extreme Fanatic




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Registered: 31/12/1969
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  posted on 7/3/2004 at 12:59 AM
That's what I never got, Feral. People will allow all these Christian clubs, but there's rarely any or less likely to be a Wiccan, Hindu, Buddhist, or Shinto club out there. Oh well. Each to their own, I guess. I never hear anyone try in this area, anyway.

 

Fanatic




Posts: 344
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 7/3/2004 at 12:49 AM
Hmm...excuse me but this is a bit off topic.

I came across this site...well some of it seems rational, other parts look "Holier Than Thou." Thoughts opinions?

http://exchristian.net/exchristian/2002_09_15_archive.php

http://exchristian.net/exchristian/2003_08_12_archive.php

If this is too off topic I'll move/ delete it.

 

____________________
co-worker: "Your gay!?"
myself: "Didn't you see my rainbow pin?"
co-worker: "I just thought you liked skettles."
-(yes, it actually happened to me)

 

Extreme Fanatic




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Registered: 31/12/1969
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  posted on 6/3/2004 at 12:10 PM
ok... lemme ask this... is having a satanist club, a wiccan practicing circle and a meeting place for those who think that oreos are the salvation of the universe all ok?

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.





Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 656
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 6/3/2004 at 10:45 AM
"Not all who say 'Lord, Lord' will go to Heaven, but those who do the will of my Father." (Matthews)

I always liked that line. I think I'll be having to use it against people soon...in my school, there's a "I agree with Sam" movement that involves bringing Christianity back. Some kids are already preaching. I don't mind them expressing their beliefs, but I heard some, "Oh but you'll be double the person with God on your side" and things like that...them wanting to have their own Christian club is okay, but I don't want it to become fundamental, lmao. Otherwise I'll be pissing a lot of them off...

I have my beliefs, but that's what faith is for. If I'm wrong, well, I'm human and I'll find out. If I'm right, then I will continue on, feeling confident that I am right. No one can know, until the end, though...if that.

 

Extreme Fanatic




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Registered: 31/12/1969
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  posted on 6/3/2004 at 02:21 AM
Pretty stupid, huh? I mean, if you believe that heaven and hell are on the line, you'd think you'd be pretty careful to make SURE you were doing the right thing, instead of jumping to conclusions or following some other human's say-so. But the only exersise most fanatics seem to get now is jumping to conclusions.

 

____________________
"You can tell by the scars on my arms and the cracks in my hips and the
dents in my car and the blisters on my lips that I'm not the carefullest of
girls." - Dresden Dolls, "Girl Anachronism"

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 1810
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 5/3/2004 at 11:38 PM
the real problem is... no one really reads the book anymore...

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.
/>





Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 897
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 4/3/2004 at 03:24 AM
As far as I've ever been able to figure out from the Bible (and please remember, I'm kind of an expert, no fault of my own!) Jews as a race are not barred from Heaven's gates.

The qualifications for Heaven seem to be A. belief that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that He died for your sins, and B. allowing God to control your life. (Belief not being enough, seeing that even Satan believes that. He has to - he saw it happen.)

However, there are opportunities for those that never had a chance to hear the story, or maybe even for those that had the story presented in such a sick or twisted way that it was impossible to accept. There are several passages that seem to hint this, one about finding the law of God in the natural laws of the Universe, and another about the chap who never called Jesus "Lord", but still made it to Heaven because he acted like he did.

Conversely, there are those that say "Lord" and get kicked out of Heaven, because their actions don't live up to their words, indicating a severe lack of sincerity.

In the end, the decision is up to God, not to the people on earth.

That, as far as I've seen straight from the Bible, is the Christian qualifications for Heaven. So it would seem that all those who demonize the entire Jewish race, or try to condemn people for not using the right words or names, or even for disbelieving the whole Christian story and structure of deities are contradicting their own guidebook. You, the accused apostate, may in fact be a better Christian than the accuser.

Of course, I'm not trying to claim that the Bible is even right when it says this stuff. For all I know, there may be no heaven or hell. I'm just trying to describe what the source of Christianity says.

Personally, I don't know. I kind of have a feeling that the Bible isn't nearly as necessary as so many Christians claim. If Christianity is true, you can find it without a book, otherwise that gives readers a distinct advantage over nonreaders when it comes to getting to heaven, which is seriously twisted.

If Christianity is true, then I am OK, because it says in the Bible that those who seek the truth will find it. And all I'm doing is seeking the truth.

And if Christianity isn't true, then I'm still seeking the truth, so I can't go too far wrong, can I?

 

____________________
"You can tell by the scars on my arms and the cracks in my hips and the />
dents in my car and the blisters on my lips that I'm not the carefullest
of

girls." - Dresden Dolls, "Girl Anachronism"

 

Extreme Fanatic




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Registered: 31/12/1969
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  posted on 3/3/2004 at 11:17 PM
Ummm... gehenna is not a hebrew word

 

____________________
The earth turns on a tilted axis - just doing the best it can.
/>
/>







Hohenheim of Light~Full Metal Alchemist

 

Extreme Fanatic




Posts: 656
Registered: 31/12/1969
Status: Offline

  posted on 3/3/2004 at 10:33 PM
According to all the Jewish sources I have AND the Jews I have talked to, no, they do not believe in Hell. They do, however, believe in Gehenna, which is a place where the soul is clensed from its sins. Then the soul goes to a level on Paradise (I think that's how it goes)...

Gehenna, if compared to anything of Christian beliefs, would be much like Purgatory, which I think for the most part, is Catholic.

Then again, like Christianity, Jews have their own little cults. Hells, all the ones I talked to do not even acknowledge Satan the same way as Christians do.

 
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