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bettie_x
Extreme Fanatic   Posts: 1570 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 4/10/2002 at 10:16 PM |
Stic, I´m holding back. All I´m going to say is be respectful. You aren´t
above anyone because of your blessed pacifist ideals. You can have your
ideas and opinions just as anyone else, and if you wanna hear self
righteousness boy, I can give you a good old fashioned bettie_x vodka and
oj sermon that´ll curl your hair. But I won´t. I´ve already gone over and
over and over this whole ordeal since day one, and I´m finnished. I don´t
even wanna get into it. What will be done will be done.
The military men didn´t sign up to die or to be murderers. They signed up
to protect the civilians and pacifists in a time of crisis...which
occasionally means killing others to safeguard you. Spit on them and spit
on yourself, they´re there because you aren´t. The likelihood of a draft
is so unlikely...there hasn´t been a national draft since vietnam, and the
number of enlisted right now would not require a draft unless we started
losing..badly. There´s always canada. ____________________
Trapped in time. Surrounded by evil. Low on gas.
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Sticupus
Fanatic   Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 4/10/2002 at 10:51 PM |
| AloneSoul, kill as many as you can. I beg of you to fill that urge for
flesh; your potential is great. I feel your rage and urge to kill: it is
exquisite. Never before have I felt such a surge of energy from the will to
kill since the great Sadists of Europe existed. The Apocalypse will be
Divine, and the Flesh will flow in rivers. Make it true. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 4/10/2002 at 10:52 PM |
| I have asked no one to die for me. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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AloneSoul
Fanatic  Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
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posted on 4/10/2002 at 11:28 PM |
You didn’t want people to die for you but they did, go ahead and be
ungrateful but deal with it. I didn’t ask to be born but I was and I am
dealing with my life and greatful for the sacrifices people made for my
right to live as a American.
To end this irrational debate:
- I am not as blood thirsty as you may perceive me to be. You do not know
what I have done with my life, you don’t know about my future, you
shouldn’t even bother predicting it, you do not know my friends (and what
they know about me), damn good people who I was blessed with the friendship
of. (as I know nothing about you) You know nothing about me but only see me
by a few of my opinions and you do not feel what I feel, I am sure of that.
You are simply wallowing around in your own arrogance, gilded superiority
and mindless self-indulgence. Don’t judge others or me so hastily.
I wish you the best of luck with whatever you do, hope that you live your
life to it’s fullest and help others when you can. I am, even if it doesn’t
seem like it. After and in a war you can bring alittle good from it.
"I just want people to be happy. I don´t want harm to come anyone. I´m not
a mean person. I wish everyone in the whole planet would stop fighting and
killing ourselves."
Tim McMaster ____________________
 but at least you know, just how much pain there is in living
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 4/10/2002 at 11:35 PM |
| Flesh you shall have. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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AloneSoul
Fanatic Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:03 AM |
| And blind, cowering stupidity for you. ____________________
SRC="http://www.rpgclassics.com/shrines/snes/ff6/images/characters/kefka.gi
f">
size=1> but at least you know, just how much pain there is in living
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:14 AM |
| Coward I am not! I have the courage to stand up against a country full of
people begging to wage war. I have the courage to speak my mind against
everyone if that is what I strongly believe in. I have the courage to
choose not to murder. I have the courage to fuck my rights over, to give up
my freedom if that means never murdering another person ever. I would
rather die myself, than murder another! I would rather suffer 10,000 deaths
in prime than consider taking the life of another human being. If my death
could stop the human race from ever bringing harm to itself, then I would
quickly and gladly die. Murder and War DOES NOT STOP Murder and WAR! ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:18 AM |
| Bettie, I cannot and will not support those who advocate or commit murder
or war. If they choose not to use their minds to find a greater truth; then
they ARE beneath me and I will never respect them. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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AloneSoul
Fanatic Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:29 AM |
No wait, I just read your comment:
"If they choose not to use their minds to find a greater truth; then they
ARE beneath me and I will never respect them."
I TAKE BACK my take care and goodday.
Those people that died for your rights are better living beings than you
will ever be and I hope they send your ass to Iraq. Go ahead and live
there.
Now sit down, have some milk and cookies, live your life, I´m finished with
this debate. ____________________
SRC="http://www.rpgclassics.com/shrines/snes/ff6/images/characters/kefka.gi
f">
HREF="http://www.pathetic.org/library.php?i_memberid=2042">
size=1> but at least you know, just how much pain there is in living
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Xaoswolf
Fanatic  Posts: 463 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:35 AM |
Am I a pacifist, no, I don´t try to fool myself into believing that the
world fits into my little ideas about teddy bears and pretty flowers.
Am I blood-Thirsty, no again, I am a realist. I neither want to suffer my
self, nor do I want to cause the suffering of others, but if my friends or
family are threatened, you can be damn sure I will fight until my last
breath. And if it came to it, I would kill whatever
kike/spic/dago/nigger/jap/cracker/ I had to in
order to insure the saftey of them.
If you wanna go on a hunger strike, be my guest, and if Saddam reads about
it, he´ll just you off the list of people that he has to kill, because
believe me, you´ll die of hunger long before he decides to play nice.
You can keep on saying how you would gladly die if it meant that the world
would be happy, but in truth, you´re death would mean nothing. You could
march right up to Iraq, give them you´re little speach about a happy
planet, and after they kill you, they´ll go right back to making their
bombs to get the rest of us. Your death would give them the right to kill
more innocents. Your death would be your acceptance of their treatment of
women. Your sacrifice would also mean the sacrifice of your loved ones.
You may want to give up your freedoms, but you will not give up my
freedoms, you will not give up my childrens freedoms, and you will not give
up the freedoms that my ancestors died for.
____________________
Sometimes I dream about dinosaurs shopping for cargo shorts at the Gap.
Does that make me a bad person?
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Xaoswolf
Fanatic Posts: 463 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 12:59 AM |
Beneath you?!? BENEATH YOU!!!!
I´m sorry, but you are beneath them, about 6 feet to be exact, as they will
be dancing on your grave. And at this point, I think I would join them.
How do you expect to use your mind when the people you are trying to stop
are bloody fanatics.
Are you suppose to politely ask them to stop as they fly planes into our
buildings?
Are we supposed to softly scold them when they send biological weapons to
us?
Are we supposed to hold our breath and expect that it will stop them from
killing our innocents?
You may say that you don´t respect anybody who doesn´t use their mind, but
I ask, do you include your self in that list, as you obviously closed your
mind to the truth about the real world.
Do you really believe this is a world where we can just walk into any
country and solve our problems with huggs?
Tell that to any of our thousands of MIA´s in Korrea or NAM.
Tell that to any american tourist that is killed in some alley in the
middle east, simply because he was white/christian/american.
Tell that to the victims of Hitler, Ed Gein, and Vlad The Impaler.
Tell that to everybody who died on September 11th.
Tell that to the Native Americans.
Tell that to anybody living in France during the revolution.
If there is one thing people understand, no matter where they live or who
they are, it´s a show of power. If there is one thing that is respected
around the world, it is military might.
Sure, war doesn´t stop war, but it can keep it at a controlled level. All
pacifism does is let the madmen run rampant. ____________________
Sometimes I dream about dinosaurs shopping for cargo shorts at the Gap.
Does that make me a bad person?
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AloneSoul
Fanatic Posts: 522 Registered: 6/7/2002 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 01:18 AM |
To add one last thing:
Xaoswolf, FUCKING A!, you said it better than I could have ever hoped.
Sticupus, even though your opinions are highly unpopular and are personally
offending/angering to me, you are willing to atleast stick to your verbal
guns.
For that I admire you.
____________________
SRC="http://www.rpgclassics.com/shrines/snes/ff6/images/characters/kefka.gi
f">
HREF="http://www.pathetic.org/library.php?i_memberid=2042">
/>
size=1> but at least you know, just how much pain there is in living
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bettie_x
Extreme Fanatic Posts: 1570 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 02:00 AM |
First off I don´t wanna change anybodies mind. Everyone´s opinions are
theirs, and if held closely and convictedly, then express them all you
want.
But dont´ get all pissy when nobody agrees with you or how you express
them.
Stic, whatever put your underwear in a knot, get over it. You´re a
pacifist, fine and dandy, fantastic. But if you´re under the dilusion that
anyone who will take a kick in the balls and not want to sit back and wait
for the second hit is a murder hungry blood lusting war lord of doom then
you have a lot to learn son.
It´s like labeling all pro choicers as being pro abortion. I"m pro choice,
but I don´t want to have an abortion so I don´t get pregnant. Does that
make me a baby killer? NO. Because I avoid the situation. But should I be
raped and become pregnant you bet I would be first in line at planned
parenthood because I have the CHOICE.
I´m not a pacifist. If someone smites me on one cheek I smash them back
with a vengence...and make sure they never EVER do it again. Does it mean
that I bully and pick and look for fights? No. It means that should the
unescapable situation arrise, I suck it up and protect my ass, whatever the
cost. I´m nobody´s goddamned doormat, kicking post, or cobblestone in
their road to domination...if that makes me a murderer, then get me an
axe.
As for our military, you didn´t ask them because you don´t HAVE TO. They
do more than follow orders overseas and commit attrocities....they haul our
asses out of floods, earthquakes, disasters, and TERRORIST ATTACKS. You
dont´ have to ask them, they´re there for you ANYWAY.
You don´t have to like others opinions and stances on subjects, but dont´
expect tolerance and understanding when you show none. Didn´t even try at
a debate or even just voice your opinion...just came in mouthing off and
calling everyone who doesn´t see your side of it murderers. Fine social
skills there, boy. If it ruined your day, then you rained on your own
parade.
If you want to give up your freedom there are plenty of countries that will
gladly strip you of it.
I suggest this stops right now. Everyone either makeup or shut up or move
on. You don´t have to listen to me, of course, just a suggestion. I´ll
take my own advice, anyone else is welcome to follow. ____________________
Trapped in time. Surrounded by evil. Low on gas.
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DarkTigress
Member   Posts: 104 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 08:20 AM |
The only thing I wonder, is when is the killing gonna stop? I guess that´s
not gonna happen ´til we´re all dead.
First Afganic people die of starvation so Usama decides to have revenge and
thousands of people die in the US... then the US decides to have a little
worse revenge and starts a war, then Afganistan gotta defend themself, and
Usama gets ticked off and plans a little more revenge, whom the US of
course will revenge as well. Terrorism sucks, and should be stopped. I am
anti-killing and all that, but sure, kill Usama. I just hope it stops there
then.
I know for one that I will admire whoever stops the revenging-game first,
no matter if it´s Usama or the US or any other country, cause after a
while, both the attacker and the defender sinks to same level where both
have innocent blood on their hands. ____________________
~The World Can Continue It's Excistence Without Mankind... But What Happens
To The Mankind When The Earth Is Gone?~
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 08:43 AM |
| In that case Xaoswolf, then you wouldn´t mind if I started killing most
Americans. You see, I am Native American, and the evidence that my ´people´
are toward true destruction is the fact that their numbers are ever
shrinking, and my blue eyes. In that, I spare you and everyone you know,
because I am not a murderer like your ancestors. Your ancestors are in part
responcible for the death of mine. But the killing has to stop somethime
during existance, why not during the simple offering of peace. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 08:45 AM |
| And I don´t care who you kill to protect your ´rights´. Everyone comes from
a mother and from a family. If you want to kill to protect your family,
then you are going to kill someone from a family; thus you have started an
endless cycle of murder. ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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bettie_x
Extreme Fanatic Posts: 1570 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 11:08 AM |
It´s a part of life, kiddo. Either go hide or get used to it. Hate to
burst your bubble, but it´s the way the world always was and always will
be. Maybe not this bad, maybe worse, but some element of it will ALWAYS be
there.
Don´t bring other ancestories into this. All current americans are not
their ancestors, they were´nt there, you weren´t there, and they didn´t do
anything to you. Yes what happened all those years ago was horrid, and
filthy, but NONE of us were there so don´t even start.
You think whatever tribe your family came from didn´t engage in warfare of
some type? Look a little harder at your roots and you´ll see you´re not so
different and "above" everyone else.
Most of my heritage is from belgium. Does that mean that I call all
germans murderers because they invaded and murdered people in a neutral
nation? No because I wasn´t alive then and there isn´t a german who´s ever
done me harm.
Americans already kill each other. That´s what prison is for
(unfortunately it´s plugged up with potheads and petty criminals and the
real shitbags get out early..but for the most part, that´s what prison is
for).
I could call all passifists pussy ass momma´s boys/girls, but I don´t
because not ALL of them are pussies...just peaceful and looking for ways
around it. Not all non pacifists are rampant murderers or desire
murder...they just see things as they are, not a rose tinted idealism.
Think it´s fun living in reality?
I would LOVE to send teachers and medicine and food....so your job is to go
over there and "talk" with the regimes that are starving and brutalising
their own people and say "now silly, just let in our teachers and food and
medicine to help your country out, and don´t kill the teachers we send and
don´t shoot people who try to take the air dropped food and meds...k? that
is just sooo non peaceful and stuff. k?"
Then we can watch your head come off on national news and be reafirmed that
there is no reasoning with people that are far more brutal than we could
ever be.
Dark Tigress, I don´t know when the killing is going to stop. Soon I hope,
but I know it won´t.
And to alone, who has tried repeatedly to try to get an answer to if and
why the FBI knew about the oncoming attacks and if they couldn´t have
prevented it, why didn´t they.
The only reason I can think of is that the US gets so many terrorist
threats that it´s hard to set aside the hooey from the real ones....that
and a lot of people in there just "look the other way"...things get lost in
paper shuffling....lack of communication, and reason upon reason. I could
have been internal bickering..that´s happened before. Numbers of reasons.
Could they have stopped it? I don´t think so...finding out in time,
locating the suspects, and stopping any backup plans they may have had
would have taken far too long. They may have postponed it, but it would
have gone through anyway. THe organization behind it was so immense and in
depth that I doubt an intervention of some sort would have been effective.
Sad but true. I think they knew, but didn´t believe...because this is
america, right? We don´t get attacked by foreign entities of war at
HOME...we´re SAFE! We´ll keep our eyes peeled, but they´ve said this shit
before...crying wolf and all that. We´re safe, yeah. Safe.
Oh, and by allowing brutalities and murder to occur because you refuse to
do anything to stop it, even kill or at least disable, then you´re as
guilty as the assailant.
For a pacifist you sure do get angry rather quickly. ____________________
Trapped in time. Surrounded by evil. Low on gas.
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DevilBunny
Member  Posts: 178 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 11:22 AM |
Well, what can I say?
Of course, I´d love to see every single problem on the Earth be solved in a
peacfull and civilized way (war is far from civilized, no matter how done)
BUT being something of a realist when dealing with these sorts of things I
can say that sometimes force is a solution. But it should be the last
option.
That´s the difference between the US and European politics. In Europe (from
what I´ve seen) they (politicians) try to resolve problems through talks,
meetings etc. while the US just throws a couple hundred missles and even
more soilders.
I hate war and killing and violence, but something like the WTC attack can
not be left unanswered.
Prisons for criminals? That´s a fucking joke by me... they just sit there
and live a better life then most people in the world. AND what´s more they
live off my fucking tax money... ____________________
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Anonymous
 Posts: 116 Registered: 14/4/2002 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 11:44 AM |
I am serious about what I believe. I don’t fuck around with the idea of war
wither, it isn’t anyone´s fucking toy! (“Oh I feel like having a war
today.....”) Has everyone here against my ideas forgotten what happened in
every war this past century?... Oh they’re dead right? Oh then never mind-
it doesn’t apply.
I wish we didn’t have countries, or armies, or religion. We as humans get
so wrapped up in ourselves that we become useless and stagnant in our own
development. I don’t want to be part of any country or regime or culture.
It is a system that is destructive for the human race at this point in our
species evolutionary scale.
Also, EVERYTHING can end. Murder, war and destruction. -If I am not
mistaken, ( as you keep bashing the idea of pacifism) according to history-
HUMANS HAVE NEVER EVER TRIED PACIFISM! A government, our economic system
and our militaristic system is not the best and ABSOLUTE solution. Other
ideas can arise. Why don’t you try like me and try to think of
something????
Humans have a wonderful ability to change the way their entire society and
lifestyle behaves and assimilate to almost any condition. Saying that “That
is the way it will always will be” is ignorant. In the past the dramatic
changes in the human race with its social and technological advances is
proof enough that we can change anything. Even war.
You people do not value human life, you value your materialistic
superficial lifestyle and your short changed petty rights. And remember
what good ole’ Bush says “We must give up a few rights to ensure others.”
It can all end with a word. Then what will you die for? Try to change
instead of murdering and dieing! You can have your cake and eat it too. ____________________
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Sticupus
Fanatic Posts: 254 Registered: 31/12/1969 Status: Offline
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posted on 5/10/2002 at 11:46 AM |
| Me^ ____________________
The OBOLISK is Divine.
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