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| Drama: Shmeng 2.0 |
Posted by
Devin on Sunday, July 06, 2003 - 02:28 PM PST
"The larger the group or the longer it has been in existence (without exclusionary measures to weed out the stupid), the more bland and uninspired it will become as a whole" - Monolycus
Guess what? We are changing the site now. And guess what else? We dont care if you like it or not.This is not the first time, nor the second time. The site has been collecting cluelessness again, and faced with the choice of starting a new site and leaving this one to rot, or reinventing this one and taking it back from the hands of the average - I have decided to try and salvage this one.
There will be much fire and brimstone. Poor little feelings will be hurt. You may or may not cry, but as I've mentioned before, this is my playground. I made it for me and my people to play in. This is not a public park. You have no inherrant right to play here. If you're not approved, then you need to find another playground.
This used to be a very cool place. I used to enjoy coming here every day and reading every little thing that was posted. Now I'm lucky if I can motivate to look at the pictures in the inbox. It won't be long before I just stop visiting altogether if things keep going like this. I do have a long enough memory to remember what this place was like before though. And as much as I like to run the site for the benefeit of the members, I have decided to change my policy and only run it for the benefeit of the approved members.
So what constitutes an approved member? Have I ever personally told you that you rock? Have I ever paid you a compliment of any kind (other than telling you that you're cute)? If so then you're probably approved. Are you on the Most Active Members Page? If you're on that page, you probably don't have much to worry about either. Otherwise, chances are good that you're one of the people that is contributing to the site's current mediocrity.
It also seems that either the age or the education level of the new members just keeps going down. The reason this isn't just another one of those stupid goth sites that you're not reading right now, is because it's a grownup site. The core members are all grownups. The approved teenagers act like grownups. The posts that get approved tend to avoid the trite topics and bad poetry that all of the similar sites stoop to. If enough people really want to post that kind of stuff, ask me and maybe I'll help you set up your own trite teenager site.
And for those of you who keep submitting your "cries for help" - Knock it off. we are not your mommy or your shrink. The brilliant people here can fix most of your problems if you listen to them, but are not obligated to do so - and it's rude to ask or expect it - you can hang around and read if you want to be polished up, and occasionally someone will take on a project and polish them up - if this happens feel lucky - if it doesn't, don't get pissy about it - we all dealt with our own issues (mostly before there was an internet) - you can deal with yours (and without whining).
Now the good part. You'll notice the site looks completely different. You'll also notice that you can't find a damm thing. There was getting to be so much stuff on each page that the pages were taking forever to load, and using up too much bandwidth with stuff nobody was looking at. I've broken the site up into sections. The links at the top are your friend. Only a few things have been removed - and nobody really looked at them anyway.
The block at the top left tells you which section you're in. It also has links to stuff in that section. If you can't find something you're looking for, you're just looking in the wrong section.
There are a few new goodies. I won't give them all away since that would take all of the fun out of it all. There are also still huge ammounts of bugs. It's been a long time since the site has had a change this major, and I'm still finding bugs left and right. Please send me a note if you find something not working right.
"if you have any questions, pray to your gods of choice - if you're an atheist, heh... you're fucked."
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Average Rating : 4.5
Total ratings : 17
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| Shmeng 2.0 | Login/Create an account | 83 Comments |
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| | Comments are owned by the poster. We aren't responsible for their content. |
Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Shade (Shade@Gothcult.com)
on Jul 08, 2003 - 05:58 AM
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http://www.hotelshade.com
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Woo hoo! Raise that bar and carry us kicking and screaming into a new age and all that fun stuff! At least those of us who can help carry. I look forward to seeing how everything works out. So far the upgrade is off to a beautiful start.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Erishkigal on Jul 08, 2003 - 07:33 AM
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Hmm, from reading this I'd guess I count as 'one of the people that is contributing to the site's current mediocrity.' But this doesnt come as a surprise...as with most sites there is an 'Elite Crew' or whatever you wish to refer to it as. There is also some serious idol-worshipping amongst the members but then again is not particularly unusual. Nevertheless I'll probably still visit this site actually... although it tends to be pretty slow there are some interesting articles and sometimes some admirable photography submitted too.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 08:21 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | I wouldnt say that you are "'one of the people that is contributing to the site's current mediocrity.'", since you haven't contributed much to the site.
You are more of a lurker arent you? Occationally joining some side of some "fight" and babbling about nothing in the forums?
oh and sour grapes make for cheap whine... |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Erishkigal on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:08 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | No, I have made over 50 something posts thus giving the 'Occasional Poster' title and I've submitted an article, or rather story, before too, which I believe is alot more than some 'lurkers do. And I've never witnessed or participated in any fights to my recollection.
My statement which I am guessing you directed the sour grapes comment to was about the fact that for example Sindel, who I noticed is now on the front page of the site and has over forty pictures of herself uploaded, has never posted in the forums in the past year and tends to contribute merely pictures. I'm sure plenty enjoy the eye candy, but thats what I'd classify more as a lurker, somewhat who doesnt contribute anything valid through discussion frequently. I dont know her and have nothing against her, and yes she is a beautiful girl so they are very nice pictures, but I dont think things like that liven up the site any or help improve it, which is what the article was complaining about.
But arguments such as this bore me, and since my comment was posted in regards to Devin's article rather than to provoke some bitchy little comment, you dont have to worry about one more 'lurker' hanging around. |
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I chose Sindel!
by Rae (d.embraced@verizon.net) on Jul 08, 2003 - 05:00 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.darkness-embraced.com | "My statement which I am guessing you directed the sour grapes comment to was about the fact that for example Sindel, who I noticed is now on the front page of the site and has over forty pictures of herself uploaded, has never posted in the forums in the past year and tends to contribute merely pictures. I'm sure plenty enjoy the eye candy, but thats what I'd classify more as a lurker, somewhat who doesnt contribute anything valid through discussion frequently. I dont know her and have nothing against her, and yes she is a beautiful girl so they are very nice pictures, but I dont think things like that liven up the site any or help improve it, which is what the article was complaining about."
I would like to think that I am very close with Devin, I met him well before shmeng was conceived and given birth to. I once participated here, but for reasons of my own I felt best to take a back seat. I also run a very busy site of my own and it leaves me with little or no time to visit other communities. However, when Devin decided to move us to another server and use a new layout, I offered to help since I enjoy toying with graphics and postnuke themes. I was the one who chose Sindel for the splash screen, not Devin.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Shade (Shade@Gothcult.com) on Jul 08, 2003 - 05:04 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.hotelshade.com | | . | Sindel | Erishkigal | | Articles Published | Seven | Two | Last three posts
rough content | Thoughtful,
helpful/involved with the site
Also involved with the site | Whine
Whine
no content | | Pics posted | Need I go into this area? | | Overall contribution | Thoughtful
Eye-candy
She's quiet because she thinks before she speaks | Bitching
Moaning
Occasional thought
She's trying, but spends too
much time saying "me me me" |
Do I need to really go any farther? |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Erishkigal on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:26 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | As my original reply disappeared into oblivion, I'll sum things up before I go.
In short - - A comparison between me and Sindel is pretty irrelevant. Like I said, it wasnt personal, I didnt claim to be a more active member than her, or anything like that, it was merely an example.
- I have never bitched or moaned before on this site. Whereas I can see why you'd regard my previous post as bitching/moaning, I dont whine about how people dont accept me, or make posts about names I've been called, etc. I've participated in posts about subjects like the meaning of life so I wouldnt view my comments there as having 'no content'. I appreciate you actually made an informed observation on my role in the site but the fact that it is so far off what I've actually posted is disappointing because it basically looks like you didnt read the content of my posts to be honest.
- I havent been a member of this site for very long, so yes, I've only submitted two articles. And judging from Devin's article here, even he didnt find the site as it was very inspiring, so I dont think it is surprising I didnt make a particular effort to participate more. But I myself said I wasnt an active member, so there is nothing new there.
- I think the reception to my post proves my point about elitism. I never insulted the site or any of its members, on the contrary, I complimented it. I was the one that called myself a fairly inactive member, so any posts using that as insult are void. But of all places, I didnt expect to find such 'shmengy' behaviour in response to my comment.
I wasnt trying to make a point or create a fuss over the new site and this article. I merely made a passing comment, sorry if it somehow inflamed anyone. It is a very impressive new site layout and its good to see it running faster. I hope you manage to get more members (that get your personal approval) who contribute lots to the site, and good luck on keeping it running successfully. Bye.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Cashmere on Jul 09, 2003 - 09:47 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | When there is a comparison made with a specific example, like what you did with Sindel, it usually is indicative of a harboring resentment. You also did not take into account that she has had several articles posted, implying lack of research on your part. So by your criteria of not participating in the forums frequently I am a lurker. Several of the members of the pantheon are lurkers as well. The forums are the equivalent of everyday conversation; they are not the essence of this site. Discussing profound subjects there does not make you deep, it makes you talkative. Jumping into a diving pool does not make you as deep as the water.
There are things here that are more important than the frequency of posts. One or two really rememberable responses has more weight than several posts that everyone ignores. Repeated posting of a point will not make someone remember you more, it will make you seem redundant and whiny. Also, frequent mentioning to yourself when explaining a belief or opinion is seen as arrogance. The reference to yourself is implied.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:21 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | | may i just say that lucidity and literacy also count. and you my darling Cash, as always, get full marks. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Arthegarn on Jul 10, 2003 - 12:58 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | In case you ever doubted my opinion... You rock, Shade |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:16 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | | it might be the sword of "damn, where's my keys", you never know... |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:41 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | anytime darlin'. you do it to me all the time. I still blame you in my secret heart for my last monitor blowing up. it had many of your comments read on it and got head butted and mouths full of tea spit at it.
No really i blame the bad submissions that appeared on it. im sure they are to blame for its suicide. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:24 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | | I"m sure it was a combination of both ;P Poor monitor, it just couldn't take it anymore. If it died because of bad submissions, you'd know because before it fried out it would have switched to DOS and flashed "goodbye cruel world". |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 04:40 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | all it did was burst into smoke with lots of crackly noises. if it has switched to DOS first i would have KNOWN it was possessed by evil demons.
Is that redundant, evil demons? |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Xaoswolf (Xaoswolfathotmaildotcom)
on Jul 08, 2003 - 08:46 AM
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http://Xaoswolf.tripod.com
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After ensuring that I am still on the Active members page, I am relieved to find that I still matter.
That being said, while I think the layout is a little weird(only because it's new, I'll get used to it) I do like it.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by ickgirl on Jul 08, 2003 - 12:31 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | I have a feeling that the member approval process has not yet begun. I think everyone is still listed as a member. (no?)
How's that for bubble bursting?
I like the reorganization; I'm not sure how everything's going to work in the end, and I'm TRYING to find time/energy/motivation/good drugs/etc to help Devin out.
Suspense! Oh, and I'm back in the saddle wading through some of these submissions. Don't send me any stupid shit or I'll hunt you down.
While I'm bitching, go ahead and click that button that says "preview" and read what you have written before clicking that "ok" ok?
-ick |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 02:43 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | | fyi, most of what is in there has been there for a while now. i would recommend a stiff drink before you face any of it. no really. and a blindfold.... |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by ickgirl on Jul 08, 2003 - 03:02 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | your warning came a bit late i'm afraid.
i made my way through one, got bored, and started in on gallery cleaning. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 03:53 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | oo sorry! i think i may do a multi out of them... when i get time, or attention, or the raw nerve or something.
good luck on the galleries |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 07:16 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | | it would be wasting paper and ink and time and a good match. cathartic true, but still more effort than return i think |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Xaoswolf (Xaoswolfatvzavenuedotnet) on Jul 09, 2003 - 08:23 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://Xaoswolf.tripod.com | I meant I was on the most active members page, which he said were people that were OK.
Also, did I send you something stupid? Or was that a general response? |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by AloneSoul (AloneSoul@hurting.com)
on Jul 08, 2003 - 09:26 AM
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I admit, I've been a "lurker" during the past few months. I really haven't had the time to do much online. In fact, I was supposed to work on the FAQ but that never got done with my hands. *shakes his head* If asked (and given direction) I will help out with the site *this time I promise* and I’ll try to post more soon...intelligent posts mind you. Heh. So much eye candy...sweet. I really do enjoy the new look of the site. It’s got the looks, loads a lot fast than before and is easy to navigate...once you get the hang of it. Thanks Devin for a fabulous job done.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by feralucce on Jul 08, 2003 - 10:02 AM
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http://feralucce.vibechild.com
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I am REALLY impressed with the new lay out... and I would like to suggest that we should impliment some kinda troll judging system... I dunno... but I agree with the commentary about the past... The lack of crud made this place fantastic... and the crud seemed to be cloggin the filter...
BTW... thank you for the mention of the "You Rock" commentary...
I killed someone's groove thing... but it was an accident...
Feral
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Monolycus on Jul 08, 2003 - 03:22 PM
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Let me tell you all a little story. I was a member of a college Quality of Life Committee a few years back and there was a motion on the floor to disallow unrestricted access to what passed for our computer lab. They wanted to lock it up and have student "guards" posted during restricted hours because they were afraid that people would vandalise the crappy equipment inside. I opposed this. I was the only one who got up and made the case that people could be trusted because they would only be hurting themselves to ruin this equipment, and if you treat people as adults they will act like adults. Despite the fact that I was the only one on the committee who felt this way, they decided to give the students a chance because of the impassioned case that I had made for student rights. Of course, later that week, a student went on a mad spray-painting spree and cost the college a few hundred dollars. Needless to say, they slapped a padlock on the lab that night and I ended up looking like an idiot for trusting people. Again.
My first posting on this site was in defense of people who had screwed up and submitted pictures they had stolen from other websites. I said that we should be as inclusive as we could and people would not be disruptive if they were nurtured and brought around. We should explain to people that what they did was wrong, but we should not attack them personally as this would just keep them from learning from their mistakes. "If you treat people as adults " I argued,"They will act like adults." Well, they didn't. Shortly after my plea (which I took some initial heat over), more people hopped on the idiot train and went on a stolen picture posting spree. I ended up looking like an idiot. Again.
Anyone who wants to bust me on an ethical inconsistency charge now has the opportunity to do it (and if they catch me in a good mood, I might give 'em a cookie), but I am no longer defending the Stupid. There are enough places for the Stupid to go that getting shut out of here is not going to be the end of the world for them. Frankly, I'm as fed up as anyone else with seeing the same juvenile crap (and I am not one of the editors and only get to see what they've already filtered through!) Now I am saying: if you treat people like adults, most of them will make you live to regret having done so.
Bottom line: I am no longer against the idea of being an elitist. I have no idea if I am one of the "approved" here or not, but it doesn't matter. I understand the need to restrict the influence of the Clueless in one's life, and I support Devin's decision to do that. I myself am down to a smallish handful of folks that I am willing to respond to, and those are from an only slightly larger pool o' people that I am still on speaking terms with. I think that weeding the garden is necessary from time to time and hopefully this will make everyone's life run a little more smoothly. The site has a nice new look, and with proper cultivation it should have a nice new feel. I am
your faithful servant,
~M.
(Incidentally, nice quote up at the top of the article. I might have to put that on a t-shirt. *insert smiley face here*)
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:02 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | "I understand the need to restrict the influence of the Clueless in one's life"
that is another quotable one. I can see it in some kind of shmeng pledge.
imagine if you will...
"I, (state your name) do solemnly swear to restrict the influence of the Clueless in my life, the lives that those I care about, and anyone else i feel like bothering with. I swear to uphold the idea that all things bipedal are not created equal or at equal points in thier lives. I dedicate myself to NOT inflicting cluelessness, shmenginess, or stupidity on anyone that i dont think really deserves it.
I swear all this on (insert date here in favorite dating system) by (insert item, deity, ideology, or favorite food here), so help me get another drink."
Now that would be a shmeng party game. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by ickgirl on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:07 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | Another issue that Devin and I were discussing is that the stupids drive away the desirables! When I first began reading this article it was as if Devin was reading my thoughts. I haven't been participating in, or even reading the site lately, and neither have several people whose words I've admired. ickgirl: "It used to be smart with a bit of social, now it's all social with no smart." Devin: “Uh huh” ickgirl: “You know, you’re going to break some hearts” Devin: “I hope so"
(details slightly changed to protect not the stupids, but devin the diplomat)
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Shade (Shade@Gothcult.com) on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:09 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.hotelshade.com | "I am no longer defending the Stupid." ... "if you treat people like adults, most of them will make you live to regret having done so."
I am so glad I had swallowed my chocolate milk before I started reading this Mono, when I saw your opening I was immediately reminded of your "defense of the Stupid" in the whole pic stealing case and was terrified that you were going to try again. I am so glad you opted not to. I have watched the average IQ drop and the average Ire ratio rise to a point where what some of us like to call the "bullshit to dollars ratio" began to dip into the realm of the serious compost.
I can only say I am so glad Devin finally found the time and the energy to return to the things he loves and bring us all back from the brink. I have called Sheng home for ages, and I just realized that if I can put out three more chapters of Toy Dolls, I'll have been serializing poor Xeno's life at an average of a chapter a month for a year now. I don't want to lose this site, nor do I want to lose this community, but when we had to wade through the undertow to get to the shining island in the middle I saw alot of people sucked under. Well, I think that's enough mangled metaphors for one day.
Mono, I know you were being serious, but that was also one of the funniest things you've written in ages. Callei and Ick are back digging through the heap of doom, Devin is in his throne and I have a feeling more things are right in the world than they were last week. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Arthegarn on Jul 10, 2003 - 01:08 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | Welcome to the Elite Support Group, Monolycus! From now on, The Rebellion of the Masses is to be your choice book (as it's mine ;-) |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by VampCourt (Morbidchic@hotmail.com)
on Jul 08, 2003 - 04:30 PM
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http://www.geocities.com/vampcourt/index.html?1017202482720
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I am glad it got a makeover. seriously. To be quite honest i was getting really bored with some of the stuff in here. i remember when this place first started.. there were so many great articles and whatnot.. then it just started to sink.
now it looks great and clean and fresh. i hope that inspires people to do some good writting.
Loverly job devin!
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com)
on Jul 08, 2003 - 05:37 PM
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http://http://
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God, I'm damned glad I'm a member of the Pantheon, and have been here since nearly the bloody beginning, because otherwise I think I might be executed as a lurker! I know I haven't contributed much recently, but blame that on the busy schedule and the complete lack of energy, plus a new and burning desire to read books instead of look at computer screens in my rare, spare time. But a new format and a new policy, (especially a controversial one!) may change my mind! Welcome Shmeng the New! We needed a jolt!
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by WorthlessLiar on Jul 08, 2003 - 06:39 PM
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http://www.goth.net/worthlessliar
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Damn Devin, more power to you, and let this site evolve with the groggyness of its creator.
but I don't see the neccessity of interviewing those who wish to join. you could always write a code that deletes unused accounts. but you know better.
thank you very much.
nicky
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Cashmere on Jul 10, 2003 - 09:06 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | "Accounts will now be automatically deleted. There are tons of people signed up who have only been to the site once. As of now, any account that is not logged into for three months will be automatically deleted. Accounts with associated comments may be left alone, I haven't decided yet. This is an automated script. I don't pay any attention to it, so don't get all pissy with me if your account gets deleted. If you're not around for 3 months, it's your fault - not mine."
-Devin, The New Laws
Actually reading the links that are provided you is a really great way to prevent speaking in ignorance. Those links are given for a reason, since it would take too long to post all of the rules every time there was a post. It is not Devin's responsibility to make sure that you see the rules with every article that is posted. Nor is it Callei's or Ickgirl's or anyone else's to make sure that you have everything to read in one little post.
The links are there because the content they contain is relevent and useful and should be read. It means that the article can be understood more clearly with those specific references. It also meand that the person who wrote the article is considerate enough to place relevant information within easy reach. It is useful to read them before writing something that makes you look like an idiot.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by angel_of_tigerbear on Jul 08, 2003 - 08:57 PM
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http://geocities.com/got_baby_69
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In the past, all I have done is come to Shmeng to enjoy reading most any posted comments. This is my first real comment on an article because of this fear of rejection complex that I believe I have. Parinoid that any single screw up that I will be judged as an idiot of some sort, in addition to my use of my knowledge. I know I use to be really intellegent for my age, and now, I feel as if it is all slipping. I know that when I do come here, I feel comfortable. I hate changes, but I love how this one has turned out. This site is amazing and I am hoping to have been one of the welcomed because I know I am pleased to come. To conclude, Devin, you are a really great person. I hope to speak again with you soon. Maybe one day my comments will become more interesting.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Anonymous-Coward on Jul 09, 2003 - 12:07 AM
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Thank you! *sings halleluja*
To everyone who worked on this superslick layout and are providing the proverbial boot in the seat to booring mediocrity, thank you. I'm glad to see that the guns are manned, and that the drama/dramatists are on their way out, with the door happily slapping their asses after. I don't think I've been "active" on this site in months, and even then it was hit or miss. It comes down to the fact I was sick of posting as I usually did and having someone I don't know freak out, expect me to explain myself, expect me to know their issues and how it somehow remotely relates to a comment I made, and then retract it, which I refuse to do. Instead of heated debates or just plain out conversation or laughter, or a twist on things that made the gears in your head screech to a halt, it was drama drama drama. All I ever got back from reading anything was a sense of being stripped of my I.Q. for merely having it on my screen (and editors, I don't know how you sift through it and retain your sanity or your intelligence. Are there special helmets I can get for that?). So I opted for silence instead.
I (as many other people here) remember when this site had a member list of 5 people. FIVE. And between five to ten people and a few wayward lurkers, they managed to come up with at LEAST one new, interesting, and relavent article a DAY. I couldn't keep my hands off the computer. Then the member list grew, and grew and grew, and oddly enough the articles were fewer and fewer, and less and less interesting and relavent. Oh, and more irritating.
I'm glad to see that you've taken the situation by the balls and given it a good hard twist. And a makeover. MAD props guys.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 06:58 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | Ah sweet memories. the two page long posts, the raging debates that took weeks to end, the fun telling people to go away, the hours and hours it took to respond to everything that you wanted to respond to...
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:33 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | *sniff* memory lane always gets me choked up *sniff*
and all of that excitement with only five to ten people! I remember you and devin dragging me here kicking and screaming "noo nooo I dont' WANT anything new! I wanna stay in the saftey of the goth test bitching forum nooooooo!" and then I was like "oh. oh this is much better" *lol*
I hope the housecleaning, the new "rules", and the shmancy new layout will put things back to a semblance of what they once were. I've always been a believer in quality over quantity (people/posts) so I've got my fingers crossed. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Arthegarn on Jul 10, 2003 - 01:19 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | | I even miss Comedian and me banging heads at each other... |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 01:23 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | | Only so often, every now and then, do I miss that. And miss lighting a fire in his Mr. T underoos with nice, heady, pro veganism propaganda. *giggle* those were the days *sigh* |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 03:12 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://http:// | I remember that, Bettie! Back in dear old "Gothic Enlightenment", which I stumbled upon through some mysterious and forgotten link once upon a time, when I was trying to figure out if I qualified as "goth" or not. Funny how it mattered to me then. I remember how "Laurie" kept getting nagged to get with the program!
I also remember my first Shmeng/GE battle, fighting some know-it-all Christian guy who wanted to call you all evil and troubled, and I got pissed cuz he didn't even know you guys! Neither did I, but it's the principle of the thing, you know! And he ended up saying I was a "Moby-Christian", which I really didn't get. I didn't even know Moby was a Christian at all!
Shmeng has seen me through some hard times, the back-and-forth with my boyfriend, the development of my religious existance, the birth of my daughter, etc. Sometimes I wonder how I would have made it without certain ones of you (you know who you are!)
And I remember my big Christianity rant, and how cool it was to disagree so strongly with some very intelligent people, and not hold back, and still remain friends at the end. You couldn't do that anymore, at least before Devin started weeding. Too many people would get their feelings hurt, and ruin the fun for the rest. Even my fights with Comedian were deeply satisfying, and though we were at each other's throats, still, he would never back down, and that was a good thing. Most people nowadays give up at the first sign of disagreement or unpleasantness, and that ruins the whole point - to test our opinions, or at least to vent our frustrations. When people go wimpy, all you get out of the encounter is a vaguely guilty feeling for being such an asshole, or else extreme irritation at their spinelessness or whininess!
So now, let the rants begin, please oh please! |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 10, 2003 - 04:14 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | I so remember those days! you were our token Christian (and you know you are the only person i will spell that word out for *wink*) and that total jerk wanted to call you names after he told us we were all going to hell. I seem to remember bettie says something like "well at least you wont be there so it must be a nice place".
I lost a monitor to that arguement. I spit too much tea at my screen while laughing.
it took cajones back then to be part of shmeng. You (and I and everyone else) had to earn it, not just show up and be whiny and have someone else "protect us". |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 06:02 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://http:// | God, how I used to fight tooth and nail for Christianity to be taken seriously! Little miss Resident Christian as I am! Now I don't care a fig for Christianity - just for the intelligent, decent people who happen to also be Christians, and unfortunately get lumped in with the lumps of pure shit who have made it the one religion it's PC to bash.
But those old discussions used to make me think about what I REALLY believed, and not just give everything the old names and thought patterns that I've been trained to. I really don't think my beliefs have changed in the essential (lest I seem a turncoat), I just don't place much importance in what words or books you use, or what name you call yourself.
What you say is true - we had to fight for our positions, and prove our worthiness, not acquire it by default because no one is decisive enough to break our bubble. No one pitied me or was easy on me in my head-butting episodes. And I never broke down and whined about how people weren't giving me a fair chance. And look at me now - I'm Mother Confessor!
Shmeng helped me so much to become who I am today, it would have been a shame to let it slip irretrievably down into mediocrity and low-grade whining and bickering. It used to be so pungent, and I think with a little ruthlessness, it can be that again!
Let Devin arise and let his enemies be scattered! It is time to separate the sheep from the goats! Depart from us, ye workers of mediocrity! |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Arthegarn on Jul 10, 2003 - 01:17 AM
(User info | Send a Message) | That responds to Arthegarn's Responsibility Dissolution Theorem. It basically states that the fewer the people involved in a project, the bigger sense of identification and responsibility will the eacho fo the members have as an individual, whereas the more the people involved, the bigger the sense of "something-should-post-something-interesting-but-who-cares-if-I-don't-do-it-somebody-else-will" (as applies in the case now under study, the original example was: if somebody trips and you're the only person in the street you'll run to help him get up, but if somebody treeps in a street full of people nobody will help hir at all)
Unless the street is full of exceptional people, as this site is (blinks) |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Domkitten (saradevil@saradevil.com)
on Jul 09, 2003 - 12:51 AM
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Heh, leave it to Devin to write an article that will make all the stupid people come out of the woodwork in defense of themselves.
That's the great thing about the stupid: You can present a general garment and they will claim it is cut to fit them. Easy way to figure out who to pic as target practice.
The new site, if of course, fantastic, and I am looking forward to really enjoy it once again.
Again, Dev, you rock.
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Re: buttal.
by Monolycus on Jul 09, 2003 - 03:14 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | DK is one of the least arrogant people that I have ever met in my life. I have never known her not to work tirelessly for other people, even when it was to her own disadvantage. While I have not agreed with everything she has posted on the site, her contributions have been consistently thought provoking and she has had the good grace to take criticism contructively and not personally. While we are speaking of her contributions, I would hasten to remind everyone that she paid for three months of server costs to keep this site running when she was still a brand new member (and I also know that she is not a rich person). If that is arrogance, Devin (and the rest of us) could use a bit more of that.
~M. |
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Re: actionary
by Monolycus on Jul 09, 2003 - 05:51 PM
(User info | Send a Message) | Wasn't looking for your love on E-bay. There's a big diff between emotional blackmail and doing more than talking the talk, and the question is about the genuine and quantifiable contribution DK has made to the site. She and Morte have done as much walking as talking which makes up for quite a bit in my book.
There's also a pretty big diff between maintaining high standards and being downright ungrateful. If we are going to overlook contributions from people because they don't hang out with the hip kids, I'll be shuffling myself off to the dust pan during the clean sweep with the "unacceptables". You can take that as "sour grapes" if you want to... and if you do then I guarantee you won't care for anything else I'd have to say on the matter. How's that for taking your bait?
~M. |
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Re: actionary
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:21 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | sorta below your usual standards really, but totally overlookable as you are, i am sure, busy today.
It is not often that you stoop to idiomatic language and straight forward emotion appeals. Normally they are better couched in pseudo-logic and big words.
Frankly i was hoping for better. |
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Re: buttal.
by callei on Jul 10, 2003 - 02:23 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | What I was actually trying to get across there Mono was that IF she had a problem with something, THEN she could fight her own fights. It is pathetic and bizzare that you would use her as an excuse to fight with someone that you like to fight with anyways. Its not being heroic, or a good friend. Its not a good person or taking a buddy's back.
It does make you look silly. That she let you and didnt tell you to eat shorts and get out of her way, well I am sure she has her reasons. I can just hope that is not because she was trying to be "nice". |
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Re: buttal.
by Domkitten (saradevil@saradevil.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 06:46 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.saradevil.com | One, as for being arrogant: Really, Stic, come off your high horse for a second and join me up here on the mountain of inflated ego. I’m serious, really.
Two, Mono, thank you for defending me, I appreciate it greatly, because I know what it meant to you to write those words. I understand why you felt a need to do it. Like I said, I think it was silly.
Three, Callei, I’m not sure why you are picking on Mono for defending me. I don’t think I was being used as an excuse to fight. I think he was simply trying to keep me from getting into a fight, because I can on occasion put my foot in it. I appreciate that, but since HE has suddenly been made a bad guy I’m just going to mention that is highly unfair. As for being nice, what’s wrong with being nice? I thought Devin liked nice. I suspect he might prefer it over ridiculous and juvenile name calling and squabbling. Name calling that I felt just find letting go and not mulling over, really, until I started paying attention to what was being said.
Four, as for my initial quote which was read as arrogant by Stic, well, see now that is all fine and good. I was simply making a point after having read several posts which began “I can only assume it’s me, etc.” There is this wonderful thing about stupidity being ego-centric. The stupid frequently are the center of their own universe. Hence a need to immediately assume that anything said about anything in general must be directed at them. As we get older we usually develop more of a personal ego and gain an ability to filter this response so that we learn to know when we are being talked about and not to assume that “everything is about me.” It’s ridiculous and the kind of narcissistic baby-angst that is bringing the site down to begin with. To recap:
“It also seems that either the age or the education level of the new members just keeps going down.”
It is important to learn to not take things personally. I don’t take what was said personally. The only thing I really was concerned about was Mono going bat and getting slammed in a door. Now isn’t that unnecessary shmeng flinging?
Again,
“There will be much fire and brimstone. Poor little feelings will be hurt. You may or may not cry,”
I have chosen not to cry, I have chosen, in fact just to wait and see which heads roll. If it is highly arrogant, then yes, I think mine will still be here in a few days, but I suppose we will all see.
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Re: buttal.
by callei on Jul 10, 2003 - 07:34 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | See i knew you had a voice and didnt need/want someone else putting words in it that aren't your own and have no bearing on your opinions!
As for teasing Mono for getting baited, I usually tease him for it. I care enough to rub his nose in it when he does something silly and starts trying to swallow his own toes. |
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Re: buttal.
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 10:36 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.obolisk.com | I didn't call you arrogant, I asked a question. You answered it here:
"It is important to learn to not take things personally. I don’t take what was said personally. The only thing I really was concerned about was Mono going bat and getting slammed in a door. Now isn’t that unnecessary shmeng flinging?
Again,
“There will be much fire and brimstone. Poor little feelings will be hurt. You may or may not cry,”
I have chosen not to cry, I have chosen, in fact just to wait and see which heads roll. If it is highly arrogant, then yes, I think mine will still be here in a few days, but I suppose we will all see."
That's all. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Squire-of-Gothos (Brian0049@hotmail.com)
on Jul 09, 2003 - 08:58 AM
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It takes a small man to say that it takes a big man to admit he's wrong, and then proceed to admit his wrong doing, but still I feel at fault. As of late I have probably contributed to the mediocrity of the site, but It's a built in defense of mine. If I suround myself with ediots, I begin to exhibit ediot qualities, and vice versa. So I think the enema that the site has been given, which in a way is like an Ice Age, will be a good thing. A massive change in social climate should kill off the weak and leave the strong to adapt and survive. So yeah, masterful work Devin, it looks slick, it works smooth, and I hope I don't make myself look like an ediot on the new baby you've birthed.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com)
on Jul 09, 2003 - 09:06 AM
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http://www.obolisk.com
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I read this article and the links above over and over in excess. I toured through the site and I love the changes. Though I must admit, I find this article, and changes of this site and the feelings behind it all depressing. I really enjoy coming to shmeng. I have always respected that it wasn't my site, and I would obey all of the rules and respect the people who deserve it. I love reading the articles. I love to think, discuss and bitch in the forums. But I'm sorry I grew to like it so much, because this is not my site. This is my home page. I come to it and read hourly if not daily. It has become a comfortable routine. I always have my source for good discussion, thought, and silly fun. Now I have a headache. I’m sorry Devin.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:50 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | I"m sorry you find it depressing, tho I don't see exactly why. If you'd have seen the way the site was even little over a YEAR ago, and then what it was a WEEK ago, you'd perhaps think differently. Yes, it is sad that he had to do what he did, but it had to be done. The site just sort of outgrew it'self. You have to admit that it became less of his baby and more of a monster (remember all that stuff jammed onto the home page?!) When you have a small "group" (for example) you have a sort of comfort with in, nobody is out to prove themselves to anyone, you can present an idea as just that and see where it goes. When that group grows, it becomes more detatched, and tho there may still be a sense of a core, the fringes get frayed, there's more general disarray, and there's more of an urge for hangers on to latch on. They serve no purpose other than to just BE there, and occasionally get the urge to jump into the middle of the crowd and yell "HEY LOOKIT ME LOOKIT MEEEE" and the whole ideal that began the site is simply lost in the confusion.
Don't think of it as a massive change, just think of it as Devin got sick of the pollution and busted out an economy size febreeze canister and started spraying. This site has never (and will never) be bout how cool you are, it's about whether or not you can hold your own, show a little creativity and thought, and have something to say that makes sense. I think if you stick around you'll find that it's for the better. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com) on Jul 09, 2003 - 11:06 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.obolisk.com | I understand and agree with all of that, you misunderstood me. I said I like the upgrades, but face it- the reasons behind it are shitty- Who wants this web site to go down hill? That's the depressing part. It's also depressing that Devin isn't having as much fun- that this is becoming a burden. It's depressing how the population is changing and the quality of the articles. It's depressing in the amount of teen angst that is foaming over.
I know that these new upgrades and changes are for the better, and I am glad for them. This site needs them. But what do some of them mean exactly? What exactly is an "approved member's list"? Will that prevent me from coming back? What about other people? Is that itself progress, or will that just be the second flush taking the site with it? |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:25 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | it is the (roughly) fourth flush of of shmeng, not its second. Scourging has always made it more fun in the past and is doing it again this time. Who cares about progres? Its not about progress. This isnt a democracy or a meritocracy.
And what about other people? This site isnt for everyone, it never has been and (i fervently hope) never will be. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Sticupus (sticupus@hotmail.com) on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:54 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.obolisk.com | I know, I understand that. I think I'm just considering myself. I love Shmeng, and it has become something I look forward to visiting everyday. I feel a little foolish and naive for not considering that someday- Shmeng may not be there. I feel a little hurt and uneasy that's all. I am reminded of a quote that I modified in my head to make it fit the scenario, and it makes me feel better. It isn’t spiteful, and is not meant to cause pain; it isn’t to upset people or make them feel inferior. It’s purpose is to state the facts, and let them be known by all, so if anything ever happens that leaves them Shmengless, they won’t be surprised- but only a little empty. “You fall in love with Shmeng, but Shmeng doesn’t fall in love with you.” |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Anya (Enternamehere@enterhosthere.net)
on Jul 09, 2003 - 04:51 PM
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http://kirashi.envy.nu/index2.html
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I'm not totally sure where I am placed as far as approved members, but I try to contribute whenever I can.
More or less, I enjoy the changes. I do not see why Devin should not upgrade the site like he has.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by callei on Jul 09, 2003 - 07:27 PM
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I just have to point out that this article has gotten more comments that the last say 10 put together. I love that.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by ravinsaend on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:11 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | I noticed that myself.
Unfortunately the larger number of them are basically pointless, roundabout, and VERY circular, it just goes to show that Devin is 100 percent right in what he has said in this article.
Alot of people don't seem to udnerstand that he's basicaly telling everyone where to shove it if they don't like it, and half the people that commented keep saying stuff like "Well *I* don't see why he shouldn't change the site."
I should hope they don't. People..it's his website, on his webspace on his hardware that he's put on a nifty net connection and placed on the web for HIS enjoyment.
It's kind of sickening that some poeple think their opinion matters to you all.
I know mine doesn't, but at least I realise that.
I actualy quit reading the articles and such almost completely for awhile because of the crap you guys have has to let through just because you haven't had anything else TO let through.
I'm proud to say I've had an article denied.
It proves that you guys got sick of the half asleep things people write sometimes. I actually wanted to smack myself after I submitted that particular article because I couldn't even remember what it was I had written, so I knew it couldn't have been very good.
With that said..
I love the new layout, it's MUCH faster and much more organised and such. So far I've not encountered ny problems but if I do the first thing I'll be doing is reporting it in full.
Hopefully you guys'll get more good articles submitted, I'm rather looking forward to seeing how the changes work out now that I'm back and able to see them.
great work guys. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 01:21 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | exactly man, that's what cracks me up about some of the cats on here. They think that because they pay for internet service (or in some cases DON'T) that all your website are belonging to them! IT"S ALL ABOUT ME DAMMIT! *I* wanna play in YOUR sandbox by MY rules, because I'm ME and I"m individual and I get everything else I want so THERE. They forget or dont' care that devin runs this place FOR them, entertains them, brings good things TO them, and for nothin. All for nothin. It in fact COSTS him (time, money, energy) and still it's not enough.
I'm hoping this spring cleaning takes care of that once and for all.
I'm sure it won't, but for the time that it does last until the NEXT time he has to fumigate the place, it'll be great. |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Schizo (Aranea@spidersdance.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 02:47 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://http:// | | Yeah, I actually commented, myself, this time! Usually I'm so busy I don't bother, especially since most stuff wasn't even thought provoking to begin with! (Except for stuff like Shade's story, but how many times can you type "loved it, more please" without feeling like a broken record!) |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Meranda_Jade (Meranda@mymind.com)
on Jul 09, 2003 - 10:12 PM
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I love what has been done with the site. I fully realize that a few times a year it needs to be cleaned up, and the trash thrown out. Every time this has been done, what has been thrown out has been old ways of doing things, and new, refreshing ways of doing things have come about. It's mostly about a facelift for the site in general. It's good and helpful every time it's done. It is also stated that there will be a clearing out of certain members. Every time this statement is made, people start immediately thinking that they just have to be one of the "undesireables" because, face it, I think that everyone from the most silent lurker to the Deity himself has suffered from crippling low self-esteem at least once in their lives, and feeling like garbage to be thrown out generally does bring out strange reactions from people. Everyone here who has responded to this article saying, "Um.... I think I'm part of the problem... but I really, really hope not..." or "I don't want to be a part of the problem, and here are my ways of trying to prove that I'm not really a problem." probably were needlessly worrying to begin with. The time to worry about it is after the cut has been made, and you see whether or not you've made the cut. If your self-esteem issues do cause you to start worrying, and you post something about it, especially anything that seems in the least inflammatory or wishy-washy... well, every time this happens, tempers flare, and the wolves come out of the woodwork to feast on the crippled victims. What I'm saying here is, do not worry. Do not whine, and do not give them a reason to eat you. This will all calm down in a week or two, and most of you will be posting away once more. Also, have I ever mentioned that people being mean and nasty toward one another makes me physically ill? There are some very frightened and insecure-feeling people out there. Be kind.
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by SeraphimSilence (webmistress@silent-oblivion.com)
on Jul 10, 2003 - 03:27 AM
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http://www.silent-oblivion.com
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Wow, comment interface has really really changed o-O;
Anyway. I commend Dev on the new look and the new input, (I think that sleep dep has me a little out of place on my words, so bear with me.) While I'm not entirely sure where I stand on the approved members list, I am trying to come up with new ideas for submissions to the site, work has kept me pretty busy, and my creative genious has been dragged into making journal layouts for people. Not to mention my own. As far as other things go, I'm in the middle of typing another chapter to The Porcelain Mask, it's just my collection of short stories I type, but it's been writer's block that's kept me from typing up what I want to say.
Keep up the good work Dev, and hopefully when my mind isn't gunking out I'll have something spiffy and shiny for you to juggle with. =P
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The Gloves are off!
by Shade (Shade@Gothcult.com)
on Jul 10, 2003 - 06:53 AM
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http://www.hotelshade.com
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Wow, I'm sitting here at work, making a vague attempt to look like I'm doing anything worthy of a paycheck while I camp Shmeng and watch the comments come in and the thing I keep thinking is "the gloves are off, finally!" I remember the time when if someone said something stupid, Callei or Bettie would quietly cut them into little pieces, pick their favorite piece, and explain to that quivering chunk of flesh what they had done wrong. There was none of this worry about insecurity or people's felings, there was; quite simply, a sink or swim mentality.
The word "elitism" in it's many forms has been thrown around an awful lot lately. And the thing I keep coming back to is, when did that become a bad fucking word? Yeah the site is elitist, yeah the site is all about who can fit in with the elite crowd, yeah it's all about the cream floating to the top, and the rest being flushed. And to stave off any further prodding of the metaphor, the "floaters that I'm sure someone is going to ask about are fished out with a wire basket and chucked as soon as they are identified. Or at least that is the way it used to be.
There came a time when the site had grown to such proportions that a few of the "elite" had adopted pets if you will. Those who were showing so much potential that they were willing to ask the others to back down a bit and not turn them into so much wet pasta. The pets were nurtured, given a really miniscule amount of time to swim around in relative immunity, ad then set loose. At which point they too either sank or swam.
Nowhere is the saddest part. We actually have so many truely cool members now that confusion began to set in. The Elite had too many pets to keep track of and suddenly the pets had pets, and the elite were leaving alone the other people who should have been fricasseed, flambeed, roasted, toasted and turned into shredded beef for Bettie to turn her cute Vegan nose up at; all because they thought that person must have been someone's pet.
To return once again to the point that some of you might be missing. The trial by fire was very real, and out of it came some very strong, very cool people who have risen to top and have maintained their position there. In the last two days, I have seen a return to the old ways by Bettie and Callei that warms my heart and quite honestly puts alot of the sex appeal back into the site as well. The cries for tolerance and caring for our members are what brought this site to such depths that it needed a complete revamp and now is creating a hell of alot of work for the admins in terms of sweeping the remnants of someone else's party out the door.
It's been said better by a few of the other members, and best by Devin, so I'll just quote him "I made it for me and my people to play in. This is not a public park. You have no inherrant right to play here." This site is not an outreach program, it's not a social planner for the socially inept, it's not anything but what it is. And that is the coolest site around. And Smeng is the coolest site around because it used to, and I think, is again, run by the God, for God. The Elite get to play because this is in fact a popularity contest.
Goths bitch and moan about how the goth movement is all about equality and fair trade of ideas. This ain't a goth site. as a matter of fact, this isn't a site that can be defined by over generalization. That's part of what made it so marvelous. I have seen article that runthe range from political commentary that really made you think, to the weirdest questions i have ever been asked. I've seen and heard things that would make your skin crawl, and in the last few months. I've seen more slush pile posts, with more "hopefully they will improve" and more "Damn there was nothing else to post, but there are nearly a hundred articles waiting and this is the best of the lot" posts than i have seen quality. The response
Read the rest of this comment...
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Re: The Gloves are off!
by bettie_x (strangersangel@hotmail.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 11:59 AM
(User info | Send a Message) http://bettie_x.tripod.com/ | Good fuckin show punkin! *wOOt*
You hit the goddamned nail on the head, brother. THE EXACT reasons why I stopped posting/submitting in the first place. I was sick of this whole "sensitivity/feelings/personal" squasy crap that was going on. I was tired of getting into senseless fights over stupid shit because someone (or several people) ..welll (okay, you said the gloves are off, so they are) is a fucking pussy and can't handle reading the truth, can't handle bluntness (as I assume they're so fragile they expect everything in life to be sugarcoated to make it go down easier), can't handle someone disagreeing with them (most of those are teenagers, sorry kids, as they know it all, right?) or can't take being told things AS THEY ARE. They wanted nicey nice, play nice, tiptoe goodygoody pat you on the back and give you a cookie, and I said fuck that, goodbye. I have no time for pant wetters and emotional cripples.
We started seeing more and more posts by new members, by younger members, about how cruel the site is, how they need to learn and we should be there for them blah blah blah. Or they'd post something INTERESTING and we'd all go crazy over it, questioning it, debating it, fighting over it, and they'd be all like "Oh man, look what I did, I shouldn't have posted this everyone is fighting!!" and I'd wanna smack 'em and tell them "DUH. THIS is what it's all about! You got a reaction from something you did, you got people talking and questioning. YOU NAILED IT." and they still wouldn't get it.
And as you mentioned with the slush piles, even THOSE weren't good reading anymore! I used to get SO EXCITED when I saw callei or ick put one of those up, because I KNEW it would be entertaining...and even then, with the crap of the crap, it was no longer entertaining, it was mind numbing.
I don't come here for anyone but me. I am not here to be someone's mommy, shrink, confidant, problem solver, bodyguard, wailing wall, sounding board, or security blanket. I did not join a self help group. If you need help, ask it, but don't expect it, or expect to like what you're going to hear.
Sink or swim has always been my mantra in life, and I've always chosen to swim, because sinking is for pussies. It is also that way in the rest of the world, you sink or swim, fight or run, be hit or hit back, and more and more people all over choose the easiest route, which is down. It makes less waves, it gives a feeling of saftey because there is less of a struggle. Being around that mentality is frightfully depressing. |
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Re: The Gloves are off!
by callei on Jul 10, 2003 - 04:27 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http:// | run with the herd and get your feet covered in shit.
jsut thought i would share some of the "notes" for this article that i archived from chats in the last few months...
reasons we are changing shmeng because you arent worth the money we spend on bandwidth, the effort we make with scripts, OR the spell checker in MS word (crappy as it is)
because we cant afford that many hit men
because we dont want your karma
because reading so much banality is bad for the soul because callei would rather pour salt in your wounds than in her own.
because you issue -ridden beasts are making our heads hurt
because we cant stand worthless liars
because you all want babysitters
because we would rather be having sex
because we dont care about your disfunctional relationships
because we dont want to deal with virgin porn
because we came here to get away from people like you
because bettie cant actually set fire to your panties
because we are not your shrink, this is not your couch, and you cant pay us enough
because you are so young you are jailbait FOR jailbait because we wouldnt sleep with you if you were old enough
because callei cant afford another new monitor |
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Re: The Gloves are off!
by VampCourt (Morbidchic@hotmail.com) on Jul 10, 2003 - 07:10 PM
(User info | Send a Message) http://www.geocities.com/vampcourt/index.html?1017202482720 | | Thats something i was actually discussing with bettie last night. Im sick of nicey nice. I LOVE reading callei roasting of little lurker people. Its grand. I Love bettie's way of giving the truth and nothing but the truth. her reality doses if you will. It needs that. and i hope that with this new shmeng.. things will pick back up because i honestly miss that... |
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Re: Shmeng 2.0
by Arthegarn on Jul 14, 2003 - 12:45 PM
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Somewhat late has at least Arthegarn a little spare time to hail and praise Devin the Divine, blessed he be in all that he changes and all that he keeps, intone his particular mea culpa about the site's degradation and tell a little long boring story.
I hate the "You are right and I have little more to say" posts almost as much as I hate teen angst and/or WIG posts (though I think a little of the later can be fun and refreshing) but that's just what I want to say. The same thing has happened to several fori in which I used to write, specially to Cultura Gotica.
Cultura Gotica used to be a very special forum in Spnish. It was started by several friends of mine, with a MUCH worse layout than this. In the beginning there were a little more than a dozen or so of us, all of them extraordinary individuals, keen minds, sutile discoursers and careful, stylish writters. And all grownups, too, much like Shmeng was when I first arrived. And, guess what happened: before we knew, in a year or so, every goth in Madrid used to read Cultura Gotica. We had thousands of visits yet most of them were just lurkers, no one dared to post, and some of us found that a little annoying. We encouraged them to post, to give their oppinion, to join the debates. And that was the end of Cultura Gotica.
Before we knew some goth newbies started posting incredibly anodine stuff. They were not just the usual trolls shouting about their extremely painful lifes, their solitary adolescence, the unfairness of God, life and the world and so forth. No, some of them weren't even that interesting. they would talk about what they did last weekend, or copy/paste entire opinion articles and claim to be the authors, or even just repeat what some of the "elders" said with different words. We couldn't understand that attitude until we started hearing that almost everybody in Madrid knew about Cultura Gotica, and that it was a "must" to talk about the latest posts and opinions. More shocking to us was to know that some of us, who used to round up for drinks, were considered the cultural elite of the Scene (not that the reputation was unwarranted, of course, ehem, ehem) and that newbies just wanted to get close to us and kiss the proverbial borders of our mantles.
The debacle came, and this is what this is all about, when suddendly writting in that forum was a way to climb steps in the ladder of Madrid's gothic hierarchy. People started writting with absolutely nothing to say, our conversations and debates were lost in all that noise, and the shine of the grownups' wits was soon an exception amongst the cries of teenagers (of course some of these teenagers were 25-year-olds, if you get my meaning). Some people just stopped writting. Others tried to "redirect" Cultura Gotica to what it used to be.
We Spanish share something with Germans: a black fascist past. Germans, even with all their nazi past complex (one of these days I should post about that) at least haven't had a fascist government for over half a century. But I was born under Franco's regime. It's much more recent here, much more alive than it's in Germany and even though the regime was so MUCH milder, the nowadays results are the same: if you try to do ANYTHING that has to do with limiting someone else's freedom, even if it's just a call to self moderation, to responsibility, to ask people to think before theyt act, you are accused of being a fascist, you are reminded of the Internet's (alleged) absolute freedom of speech, thought and expression and in general put down with arguments that were obsolete 25 years ago and made up of the worse demagogy, but that no one who hasn't got a case of cucurbitacean genitality* would dare to oppose. The site administrators weren't strong enough, they weren't fast and decisive enough, they didn't dare to "cut by the healthy" the gangrene that was corrupting Cultura Gotica, and the forum faded slowly into what it is today: just another common thing.
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